Will & Kate: [00:00:00] Burners of New Zealand Australia and Asia, radically making magic on the paddock. Round the fire, B-O NZ AAR

Bonzaar podcast

Stevan: uh, bonzaar. Welcome to all. I'm Stevan Lay, and thanks for tuning in to the Bonzaar podcast, a conversation show about the 2025 underland experience. In this episode, we'll reflect back at the Underland Burn and Time capsule, this event from various perspective and thoughts such as from artery effigy, and volunteering, and offer some behind the scenes insights.

Break down some talking points from the burn and see if we can all make it to the threshold in 2026. Uh, with me to talk [00:01:00] about all these finer points we have. Sacha, Dylan, and Jenny. Welcome.

Dylan: Good day.

Jenny: It's great to be here.

Sacha: Yeah, we made it.

Stevan: Let's, uh, get some quick introductions. Tell us about how, what roles you, you, you played at Underland and, and how did you contribute to the community to the event?

Dylan: Who's on first?

Jenny: I can go first. Uh, so I'm Jenny Red. Um, in 2025, I had the privilege of being acting lead for Artery, which are the art grants. Um, I helped out with artery a bit the year before, and all of the artery, um, systems had been set up, um, by Danae in the first couple of years. And she had a brand new person.

She gave birth to a brand new person right before Artery, so she wasn't there. So I got to have the pleasure of working with artists, helping them set up their art, and before, um. Helping with the artery team, uh, to work out to distribute arts grants and, um, ignition grants, which are for more for performances than arts.

I also, um, did some shifts at [00:02:00] the, um, Coco Poco Loco Saloon and some other fun stuff like that.

Stevan: Cool. And, and Sacha Snugfuzz let's hear your story. What did you do at Underland?

Sacha: Uh, this year I focused my contributions, uh, with Center Camp, um, returning from last year and really enjoying being the center of everything and connecting people to what's going on and where they are.

I ran the first workshop of the Burn on the Thursday, which was a introduction to beatbox workshop, uh, which is very popular, went very well, and we ended up having a cabaret later in the night. Some of those students, which I'll talk about later in podcast.

Stevan: And let's introduce Dylan. How you going, Dylan?

Dylan: Yeah, I'm good.

Stevan: Tell us about, um, tell us about your journey into Underland.

Dylan: I have been aware of Burning Man for a very long time, and I'm an architect and I recently entered the kind of festival scene. I had been to one festival before Underland, uh, inter stellar. And friends and colleagues who had met me through all of that kind of dance community said, you should go [00:03:00] to this and you're pretty creative.

Why don't you put an idea for the effigy, which I did and then was told that I would be making it. So I've. I'm coming in hot

Sacha: trial by fire.

Dylan: Trial by by manufacturer and fire. Yes.

Stevan: Yeah. Cool. And we also have Lady Greythorne also joining us. Uh, Lydea would you like to quickly say hello? Introduce yourself.

Lydea: Greetings and salutations. I finally arrived.

Sacha: Welcome.

Lydea: How are we all today?

Sacha: Excellent. Excellent. What did you do at the burn, Lydea?

Lydea: Oh, nothing. I was, um, I was very low key. Yeah. I wasn't busy at all. I, um, worked on the gate, uh, brought Constable Copperfield to the gate, um, as part of the spanking Police. And I also worked in sanctuary this year and rang a workshop at a center camp.

Um, and had a little [00:04:00] renegade theme camp, toad Hall that was shooting cocktails and hors d'oeuvres to anyone who dropped in.

Stevan: So I want to get your quick thoughts about this. Year's Underland Underland pop was a theme. What'd you think of overall in general? I mean, the, the, we, we had pretty changing weathers.

Uh, we had. A different site layout. And we had more, more children, I think more kids this year.

Sacha: 10% kids.

Lydea: Yeah. That's pretty high number. Um,

Sacha: and it speaks well for the future.

Lydea: It does baby burners.

Stevan: It made it more wholesome?

Sacha: I I think it's healthy for the community to have kids around.

Lydea: Yeah, I agree with that.

I think we want to have a burn that has a voice for everyone, which includes parents and children and adults of all types. I think, um, yeah, the many, as many different diverse voices as we can get expressing themselves in the paddock the better.

Dylan: I loved having the kids there 'cause they just love the, they loved the effigy, they loved the serpent, they loved [00:05:00] getting in.

And most of the messages I reckon that were written down on little scales we put in there were from kids and they were just delightful. So insightful and clearly coming from, you know, connected families. And I think that for kids to see the, the performative and kind of demonstrable nature of how the burner community actually comes together is a key to the long-term success of the burner community.

Lydea: I think we're all there trying to reconnect with our inner child and I don't think there's a better guide to that than an actual child out

Dylan: to children.

Lydea: Yeah. To children.

Dylan: Exactly. I had a ball, their enthusiasm for what, what they were looking at matched mine and in some cases exceeded it. But, um, it was. It was, it was really lovely.

Yeah. And seeing all just, just the craft and the, and the, and the, the familial kind of linkages. I think that was really, that was really great for me.

Sacha: And it's, it's okay 'cause we can manage [00:06:00] the spaces to have adult spaces without kids as well, as long as we communicate and plan. I had to,

Dylan: yeah. And time, a great equalizer there, you know, 2:00 AM what's that kid doing here?

Sacha: I had shibari workshop happening in center camp. They asked me to keep the kids away, so I was beating on them heavily with chess. They very, were very distracted from what was going on the other end of the space.

Dylan: I don't know. Shibari might be better than chess.

Sacha: Not for the children.

Dylan: Well, you know,

Lydea: oh, I think, um, I think we can approach and we do approach everyone on the paddock individually.

Um, so one of the giftings I did this year was the, um, spanking police and Constable Copperfield was out with a spanking paddle and a very skimpy outfit. And, you know, nefarious things were done to consenting adults, but at the same time, the kids loved, um, her too. And we, she would come up, they were immediately attracted.

And, uh, we were going, well, have your parents been behaving? Have they been giving you enough [00:07:00] sugar? Have they been letting you. Stay up late. And um, and they were quite prepared to dob their parents in for inappropriate overuse of vegetables. And, and I just made the parents do star jumps and burpees or sing I'm a little teapot and, um, yeah.

And they can interact with something that can be. You know, highly sort of kink orientated for adults, but for them it's just harmless, fun.

Dylan: Love it.

Sacha: Play. Play is the glue that connects us together.

Dylan: Yeah. And it keeps us young. We need to stay that, you know, we need to be able to tap into that kind of, uh, optimism and uh, and kind of frivolity.

Stevan: And from an artery perspective, Jenni, how was the, how was the burn overall?

Jenny: Look, this, this, I mean, uh, I've been to. Three under lands and burning seeds. This was my favorite burn by a long stretch. It was so much texture this year. I mean, really. Um, I mean I've been doofing since doofing started in [00:08:00] Melbourne.

It's actually 1993 and I now think burns are better. Um, 'cause there's so much texture you can. Literally go to bed at nine o'clock and get up every day and play. And in fact, if you don't and you stay up late, you miss out on stuff. Um, the art was amazing. We have large art grants and small art grants, and so the large art grants, this is, and it's separate to the grants that are done for the, for the effigy and the temple, which are built to burn.

Um, and some of the art was incredible. We had the fairy bloom and it had, um, sea saws on it, so there were people riding on that. There was, uh, there was one extra piece that was built that was sort of a memorial. There was projections, there was small art, there was big art. And then we also had, um, ignition grants, which are performances.

And so that was roving performances or people putting on, um, food or people, uh, you know, doing some sort of live performance. And there was just, there was no way that you could experience everything [00:09:00] that was going on on the paddock this year. It was just, it was diverse. There was lots of ways for different types of people to engage, uh, and it was so colorful and vibrant.

Lydea: I wanna shout out my personal gratitude for receiving an artery grant for my small gifting. Beyond, like sort of the, the money that's provided to help support you. Um, like one of the questions in the questionnaire was like, if you don't get the artery grant, what happens to your art? And I was like, I'll pay for it.

That's fine. It's, it wasn't so much the money as the validation that I felt, which then fell through to a, a responsibility to make sure that, you know, it really was adding to what was happening in the paddock. So I think those, whoever saw the ignition grants, I'm just gonna say awesome job.

Jenny: And this, this was my realization this year and, you know, having always been like really happy just to be a paddock shit kicker and not really have [00:10:00] skills.

I started working with arts grants 'cause that's really where my skillset is, is is in nonprofit organization. And, and it, I, it brought me to the realization that, uh, you know, that as they say that art is at the heart of the burn, which is why our logo is a heart. But if you look at the burns, it's like, it's a giant excuse to actually be able to give gar, art, grants to artists.

You know, you sell tickets for people to come and see the arts, so you can give grants to artists that, that you could sell more tickets to, you know, to give more artists money to. So it's a, it's a cycle of creativity. Uh, and I just really appreciate having. That insight now. And, um, you know, there is a map and you can just see as much art as you can or as many performances, uh, and the, the diversity is fantastic.

Stevan: So what are the biggest art grants you can receive is building the temple or effigy. So Dylan, would you like to give us some insight into your experience? Because this was not [00:11:00] just your first burn, your first build, but you also had a birthday at Underland.

Dylan: Yeah, that's right, yes. Um, so yeah, I mean, I, I, I mentioned that I'd, I'd been aware of Burning Man.

Um, I didn't know that there were original burns until, you know, my crew and the people that I've been meeting in this kind of new life told me all about it. I'm a creative and I do stuff all the time. I make, I make buildings that take forever and involve, you know, thousands of people. So to, I, I, I put a little idea in for the effigy and, um, forgot about it completely.

And a couple of months later I got a phone call from a fellow named Axel, who is an absolute rock. He's the, the, the core of making this stuff. And he said, oh yeah, we've gotta organize a video call to sort of get the team together. And I was like, have I won? And he was like, yeah. And, uh, I, um, managed to [00:12:00] recruit a couple of great architects outta my team to work with me after hours unpaid because I know that the philosophies to be unpaid.

And I had had this idea, I've got really great networks into manufacturing and supplies and materials, and I managed to get basically everything donated, um, which was amazing, like waste stream, timber veneers, and, you know, $3,000 worth of robotic cutting done for two slabs of beer and lots of, lots of really great people.

So for me, the burn was, was really focused on, on trying to deliver this and make it real. And I was really anxious about it for quite a long time. But the anxiety came because I care and, uh, I wanted to do a really good job. And so I was involved with the burner crew well before I really understood what the whole event was gonna be.

And I was up there a week before and at center camp and, and, and at the, at the crew camp with the crew kitchen team and meeting all of the people and building this, building this sculpture. [00:13:00] I didn't even notice that the festival had actually started because I was so,

Stevan: yeah. So you didn't get the, the, um, the burgin experience of ringing the gong going through, uh, the ceremony?

Dylan: No, no. Everyone thought I was an old hand. Everyone's continuously surprised that I was building the effigy and I'd never been to a burn before. And in fact, it was only my ever second ever festival. So,

Sacha: sounds like you nailed the immediacy.

Dylan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Got that. Got that. Yep. Um,

Lydea: this year, stop by the gate, Dylan.

You're gonna have to ring the gong.

Jenny: Yep.

Dylan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Exactly. Exactly.

Jenny: You can catch up on that. We're right, right?

Lydea: I didn't, yeah, I reckon it was my second burn.

Dylan: Yeah. Yeah. Um, so it was my absolute favorite burn, like you can say about your absolute favorite child when you've only got one. It's um. It was, I, I have found the community, the community generally that I've met and the, and the specific burner community.

So [00:14:00] generous, like really generous, not just non-judgmental, but generous, genuinely interested, incredibly intelligent from such a broad, a broad sway of community. It's been, it's been revelatory for me personally. And I'm really, I was really taken by just the, the, the, the overall intensity and enthusiasm and community spirit of everybody getting in and building these things.

I grew up in England for a couple of years, so I'd been to a few guy Forks Nights and you know, the festival down at Penance and I've, I've, I've had experience in that kind of circus lifestyle. To see, to see such commitment and effort and care going into all of, all of the theme camps and the, and the, and the, and the moments and the, and the shows, and even the roving crews who were like delivering these kinds of, um, you know, wild experiences.

I had an, I had an absolute ball. It was truly [00:15:00] a, it was, it, it was amazing for me. And I, I put a lot into the effigy. I, it was, it's a serpent. It was a snake called office. Uh, it happened to be the year of the snake, which is sort of probably fed into it, but it's also a symbol that exists in every single culture for this kind of idea of rebirth and shedding old ideas and regeneration, but also an awareness and a, and a, and a and a, and a kind of a, an alertness about the potential of the serpent, which I think is really relevant today given the shit fuckery that's going on on the planet, particularly with humans, well, specifically with humans.

And so it, it was, it was great to finally be pointed out by somebody that was a year of the wooden snake, so I was even happier and burning it. Everyone was like, oh, did you feel sad? Did you feel, you know, how did that feel? I was in absolute ecstasy, my sister.

'cause I was building the effigy and she said, I'm gonna be there. [00:16:00] So we had an absolute ball and she took a video of the burn and when it was all going up and I'm like a kid on cocaine, it's like insane. I'm so excited about what I'm seeing and happening and yeah, it's, um, it's, it's transformative.

Lydea: I had a, a opportunity last year.

I actually went to um, three Burns last year and I, the one in Spain, nowhere. Um, it is a fantastic desert burn, it's energy, all sorts going on the workshops, all the usual things we'd expect from a burn. But being in the middle of summer and would being expensive, they don't burn anything. It made a profound difference to the connection of the community.

Um, 'cause whatever we're doing at a burn, whether we're up, laid up early, doing workshops, gifting, we're all, nobody has the same burn experience and you can put 12 people in a [00:17:00] room and none of them will have seen the same thing except for the effigy and the temple. It's what brings us together and what strengthens our community and it really is.

One of the things that makes a burn, what a burn is all coming together just to watch that thing go up in flames and feel the emotions and the connections and get naked.

Stevan: We can talk a little bit more about that later. Uh

Lydea: mm-hmm.

Stevan: Now, Snugfuzz, do you have been to all of the underland would you say?

Sacha: Uh, I think I missed the first, the first proto event. I like to say I've been to double figures of burns because I think the, the number gets to a bit of a measuring contest, which is unhelpful for the conversation.

Stevan: Well, what's your opinion and what was your experience of Underland 2025?

Sacha: Oh, uh, I think burns are a fractal phenomenon that come from emergent properties bonded with principles. So [00:18:00] there's many, many avenues to come in, but from two people up, if you're coming with the right intention, it's a burn. So my ones have been at speed at the Canberra burns, and my focus is generally always on the civic infrastructure.

That's what really gets me going from my first burning seed. I was waiting in line for a coffee and they were like, we need more rangers. I was like, I don't know what a ranger is, but I will go and do the thing that's needed. Um, I've been in the greeters teams and the sanctuary team and I've slowly gravitated towards center camp.

It's been really good. It's a slightly less pressured role, but you're still connecting community with information. Um, my burn started with a really intense. Wind disaster. That flipped my, uh, marquee and I thought it was all broken. I thought my accommodation was done for the week, but the, the whole team got around me.

Mm-hmm. A lot of the Toad Hall members, uh, and helped put Humpty Dumpty back together again. And then straight into my workshop, I did most of the, uh, morning sessions at center camp. [00:19:00] So, uh, I dunno if anyone came to the intense sound healing, extreme sound healing that was hosted every day, that ended up being very popular.

I'm not sure we had any repeats, but we definitely had a decent crowd across days. I've been thinking about the, the balance between how much we want to have the same workshop versus how much we want to have different workshops versus how important is it to have space in the schedule to allow and account to be more low energy?

Well, I find I sort of change what I wanna do, contributing every, every sort of three, three years or so. I don't think I've even done half of the things that's possible to do in a burn, but I really enjoy learning about all the ways we put it together, this and connected along the way.

Stevan: Cool. So how did you get in, involved in the, in the, in the burner scene in, in the Burner culture?

How did you find out?

Sacha: Uh, my mate Ash went to the first, first burning seed. It wasn't a Matong, it was somewhere else. I went to the second one in my uni break and [00:20:00] I just camped randomly in the field. And I ended up by, uh, Andy and Jen. And we sort of ended up making a thing called Camp Kas Bah, which made burritos and had a war with the unicorns and Andy went on to make, Red Earth Radio, well the Canberra ones were really, really small and really fun.

But I'm excited to see Underland grow as well. I know we're trying to be very sustainable, uh, and not be too risky, but uh, yeah, getting up to a thousand or more than a thousand, it's very exciting. 'cause there's always more than you can do, but having more of, more than you can do is even more exciting.

Jenny: Yeah. More arts. grants too. Yay. More arts.

Sacha: More arts grants. More civic infrastructure. People always say, I want more theme camps, but they don't realize you have to have the civic infrastructure. Put everything under. Yeah. Did get very cold on one of those nights. I don't know if everyone was ready for that.

Dylan: It was that wild Fog that came through was like, something outta the science fiction was like two o'clock in the morning and suddenly it's like, you could only [00:21:00] see three feet ahead of you. And I was like, where did that come from? It was wild.

Sacha: Be ready.

Dylan: Everyone should wear lasers.

Lydea: I think I was out near the temple when that came down and I went, oh, I have to get my way back to camp.

Dylan: One of the things I'm really interested in is there's a, there's clearly a massive sort of meta narrative on master planning for Burning Man. You know, with the whole kind of, um, circular, kind of radial city planning because it's basically a city. I'd be really interested to see if Underland could actually deploy some urban planning around the way the shapes of the places are made.

Because unlike where there's like camping over there, partying over here, the, the nature of the spaces and the, and the kind of the, the, the, the gifting and the little things that people do feels to me like there might be a way to plan it [00:22:00] slightly more organically. That that actually builds a little bit more engagement in the way that the spaces work.

I'm not talking about the actual camps, but their location and proximity and how you get to them. It felt like, it felt a little bit like I was at a, um, you know, royal show or something where, where all the camps were sort of just lined up in a big empty space in, in front of them and you, it felt like there was a way that we might be able to plan the space a little bit more integrated, if you will.

Sacha: It was very linear and the traditional circle space has a number of benefits for those emerging properties. I was talking. I'm not sure of our topography and whether that allows for a circle. Might have to look at some other structures,

Dylan: but No, no, no. I don't think it should be a circle, particularly if it's gonna be back in paradise.

But I do think that there are a couple of, there are a couple of tricks and clues around the nature of, you know, where, where spaces are that sort of stop you going, oh, am I going left or am I going right? Or where, where am I going? I think that there [00:23:00] would be a way to do some really interesting drawings, ideally with the theme camp leads in, in the room to kind of like spatially, spatially arrange it in a way that flows really sweetly.

Lydea: Are you volunteering for town planning there, my friend?

Dylan: Yeah, of course, of course, of course. I am. Look, I, I, at the end of this, I was, I was, um, really taken by what, what, what was going on. And I could also see a couple of gaps in, in some of the systems perhaps that, that are deployed in the, in the creation, there's an incredibly strong focus on when the thing is burning.

There are like, you know, dudes in robot suits and fucking fire engines and everything's fucking set up for this moment. But on the lead up to it, there was almost nothing like, how is it being built? What's the structure, what's the safety issues around this? And how are we kind of connecting all of these things together?

And so I've offered already to CAV to hang in there for the next nine years and, and at least if I don't win the idea to [00:24:00] build something, whoever does, I'm happy to throw my knowledge into making sure that. Deliver that it's safe, that it's, that it's something that, that isn't ever gonna, you know, create a on the Wednesday before it starts because somebody thinks it might fall over.

I think that's really important to have that kind of, those kind of systems and checks in place on the way up to, and not just for the build, uh, the burn, but, but through the build phase as well.

Jenny: I love that mindset. You know, the further you get into a burn more, you realize the incredible number of hours of volunteer time, effort, expertise that go into creating this.

You know, and it's not a commercial exchange. You can't just buy a ticket and attend. It's actually a co-create. Everybody contributes, you know, that's what I love about it. It's just seeding with creativity. Yeah. Everybody can find some way to contribute, but the more you contribute, the more you contribute.

Dylan: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like one of the things my practice used to do was we, [00:25:00] we would work for the, the city of Melbourne on all of their art commissions in the laneways. So artists would win their project and then they'd be sent to us and we would look at what they were doing and try to understand how we might make it and what the construction was and how we could light it properly and, and, and sort of.

Help realize their vision, which is, which is, which is a wonderful part about architecture, is you can't, it's not just you're not an artist. You're working in a collaborative space and you're trying to deliver a vision that's, that's not necessarily a singular vision, but as a, a community vision. But if there is a singular vision, your job is to really, how do we make this the best it can be?

And so that's, that's something that I, I think is, is really a value to, to the community and to the event. And yeah, it extends to urban planning. Like how do we plan this out? Where do, where do we put the things? How do we, how do we map it above and beyond? Above and beyond the kind of the prosaic you need to be able to drive in and get here and go there?

What, what are some of the moments you could create in this space?

Lydea: I think there can be some really beautiful [00:26:00] experiences going, as you said, from one theme to camp to the other with the town planning organically thought out, to be able to create moments of connection and interaction as you go past.

Bringing that art in and, and weaving it through and, and creating Yeah. Streets and thoroughfares and avenues where different activities might be happening.

Dylan: Yeah, exactly. Particularly for kids. Like, for, so for when the kids in the day, in the kid. In, in that, when, when you've got that broader range of community at play, having that ability to kind of like navigate, you know, intuitively around things go, oh, I wanna go back to the space where all of those things were, or where these things were, as opposed to an object in a paddock.

I think there's a real, there's a real power in that.

Stevan: Let's go on a quick break and we'll be right back to talk about all the art, auto theme camps and some of the things that's in the survival guide.

Adrian: Hi, this is Adrian Red Rock [00:27:00] at Ranger HQ on at underland on Friday. And I'm just reminded, again, entering back into this community how amazing and supportive the burner community is. Walking in yesterday and sitting up tent and just everyone is so welcome. So caring and being part of the Rangers, seeing the extra level of care that's there.

A great reminder of what an amazing community can be with shared values and a collective intention of looking after each other. Cheers, Adrian out.

Kimmi: Hi, this is Kimmi. I'm from Melbourne and I'm here at, uh, Underland number three. This is my first one. It's taken me this long to get here, um, after enjoying seed in the late 2000 teens and oh my goodness, this is so delightful.

Just such good vibes. Um, it's not, it's not a huge big festival, which is really, really delightful. You can walk around, see everything so much to [00:28:00] see. Um, yeah, and I'm volunteering and that is the best because you get to walk around and see people and have a boogie and, you know, support the crew. Cool. All right.

Thanks.

David: My name is David. I'm here at Underland 2025, looking across the nice sunny fields at Karl, walking across with this sparkly jacket. This is my second underland. It's very exciting and I'm enjoying myself thoroughly.

Patrick: Yeah, why not?

Why not?

So I'm Patrick, um, from Ireland slash Australia slash several other places. And, uh, yeah, a message to the community. Uh, it's good to be back actually, is my message. You know, I've, I've disappeared for a bit into like life and, uh, yeah, it's, it's fucking great to be back and have a dance, man.

It's fucking awesome. Yeah. Time to go.

Vern: Vern Bendigo just down the [00:29:00] road. So happy to be amongst all this colour in life again. So good. Makes me smile.

Magnus: This is Magnus. Lovely to be back at Underland watching it grow each year. This year seems like it's really starting to blossom so much care and in goodwill being put in, uh, inviting more people to come and join that next year.

Michael: Hello, future Underland listeners. My name is Michael here on the beautiful player that is.

Underland, this is my first underland. I'm really impressed by it. To be honest. I've been away from Melbourne, uh, for like the last five to six years, so I haven't been to an Australian burn in five to six years. And I've come back and I'm just immediately welcomed with that familiar feeling that I've missed so much.

And I've been like, uh, noticing just like the level of craftsmanship in like the Australian burns. I feel like there's a lot of like really talented craftsmen [00:30:00] who are just like the effort and the uh, attention put into the effigy and the temple and, and the saloon looks incredible. God damn. Yeah. Uh, having a great time.

What was your name?

Stevan: Steven

Michael: and Steven's. Really nice. He gave me a pen.

Hotwire: Hi everyone. Uh, this is lock here. You may remember me from past Burns as the life lemon guy.

If you were a previous lemon receiver from Life, I'd like to hear from you. Uh, yeah, I don't know if the bit was received where everyone got the bit, but it was really entertaining from

my end to, to gift. Um, yeah, Lock out.

Thanks.

Chris: Hello there. This is Chris. I'm such a beautiful time being back here at the Burn and I just wanna send love out to everyone and thanks for all the sharing and thanks for all the love and I'll see you in the [00:31:00] paddock.

Snoozing: Oh, this is Naomi from, um, Sydney based. Um, I got to come to this incredible burn with my lovely friend Cara, AKA, my doof mother.

Um, and even though it's not a doof, it's a burn. Um, and I'm having a lovely reentry into burning life after, uh, a long gap since burning seed and I am having the best fucking time. Everyone here is super lovely. There are no ies to speak of. The ground is incredibly soft and beautiful, and yeah, everyone is incredible and everyone is

burner than thou. I guess.

I feel like I should have [00:32:00] something more profound to say, but the only thing I can think of is a fart in the hand is worth two in the butt. Goodnight. Here you go.

Stevan: Okay, we're back. Let's talk about, let's get into the, uh, all the theme camps and the, all the fuckery, the shenanigans. First of all, let's talk about the survival guide. I thought it was well written. Now, some of the things that stood out for me were the sound etiquettes, the quiet times. Does anyone know what the quiet times were?

Do you remember?

Jenny: Think it varied. There were different end times on different days, but, um, you know, it was generally speaking. Yeah. After two to 4:00 PM am

Stevan: it was from 4:00 AM to midday.

Dylan: I,

Stevan: I appreciated the break.

Dylan: I didn't even know there was a survival guide. I just survived.

Jenny: Dylan, I'm amazed you made it through.

You just survived.

Dylan: I know. I just survived.

Lydea: I think one of the lovely things that maybe put forward

Dylan: struggle town, babe. It was struggle town.

Lydea: There's a potential possibility maybe in the future with town planning to, sorry. Forgive me. [00:33:00] Is can people hear me? Yep. Okay, good. It just glitching on me. Sorry about that.

So couldn't hear it for a sec.

Stevan: Yep. Yep. Um,

Dylan: yeah. Go. Lydea.

Lydea: I think, uh, uh, there's an opportunity as we grow to look at maybe in that town planning, having different sound zones. Um, the ability for there to be, say, a red zone where the party might go all night or, or as long as it can, given the, the local council and community restrictions and, and then like medium areas that might shut down to be a little quieter at midnight.

And then green sections where it's like. You know, hey, this, this, there's no PA systems or anything in this area. This is an area for quietness and sleep. And then again, people can have the burn that they want and I think as we grow we should be hopefully be able to spread out that way.

Jenny: Yes, this year we had more music camps as well, so it was more different places to go and enjoy the [00:34:00] frosty nights with a, uh, you know, nice hard dance to keep warm.

Lydea: I think the sound camps was fantastic, how you laid them out that, um, I was tucked behind center camp, um, and it was incredibly close to the action, and yet still really quite quiet in our camp.

Jenny: There was actually a lot of thought that went in. It was a different layout this year. The road went down the middle was sort of what might have been a visage, just roundabouts.

If we had traffic, there was art at all those center points. Then the sound camps sort of faced outwards in the same direction so that the sound didn't interact and we had a lot of sound camps. In a row so that with no one camped in front of them, the sound of the camps really didn't intersect with each other, which was really great.

Um, and then there was

Dylan: also Positeka, which intersected with the entire camp Lit Positeka Sound Stack was the best I have ever experienced.

Jenny: They'll be happy [00:35:00] about that. Um, yeah, and there was like quiet camping and family camping. And so I think the family camp area had a real vibe. And the kids, a lot of them, you know, were in that similar age group, so they had their own, you know, vibe.

So there was some, there were things about the layout that was progressed year on year.

Dylan: Yeah. And look, my comment about town planning and sort of urban planning, that space wasn't a criticism of what it was I just saw as. An architect perhaps an opportunity to build a little bit more magic into it. 'cause, 'cause there are some very magical planning things that you could do that really kind of give you discovery and rather than walking up and down a road, there's a, there's a kind of a loop track that that does, does something, um, I dunno what it is, but I love to doodle and I was doodling sort of things and thinking, Ooh, this, this would be interesting.

And that would be interesting. Who knows?

Jenny: There were some great camps this year. Like I wanted to do a shout out to Auntie Maria's, which was just this gorgeous camp. It had so much texture. You took your shoes off, you went in [00:36:00] little comfy and there were cha rugs at someone had bought at op shops and washed repeatedly.

There was all this stuff that had been crocheted all these colors and it, it, you know, they had DJs playing nice tal music and people in there just hanging out. Uh uh, it was the most divine space. And they also had a few sessions where there were serving up food. Um, glutenous snacks that I didn't indulge in.

But, um, you know, and then across the way was the gays who did a fantastic, like they won the paddock on the first night of, um, sound camps. They had this fantastic party with all of this glow decor, a lot of which had been made from recycled bottles and Barbie dolls. And I, I mean, it was just great. Um, and then Coco Poco Loco was back with a saloon that was mm-hmm.

A piece of art in the execution. Yeah. And came with crazy like, you know, shenanigans. So daytime, uh, western themed, you [00:37:00] know, rodeos and, uh, was just fabulous. And there was just some of the selection.

Stevan: Yeah, we had about 20 theme camps all up. I'll just quickly go, go through some of them. Well, most of them, the abyss villains, sin, city Coco, poco Loco, positeka, lounge and, friends, low and Slow.

We had O Captain, my Captain Underpants, postal Service, telekinetic, tiny, shiny, the Gaze, aunt Maria's Eternal Flame Harmony Lab, and the Hippie Trap and the Bower kids, they had their own camp. Any of those camps that stood out for you guys wanna mention?

Jenny: Yeah, I possible to actually experience everything.

Dylan: I found it really impossible 'cause I didn't have the, the survival guide nor the like, what's on when.

So I was kind of wandering around just being looped into things as they, as I may have, you know, kind of universe Juice aligned with them.

Sacha: My general approach is to plan exhaustively and then improvise wildly.

Dylan: Yeah.

Lydea: Yeah. I tend to, but it's nice to, it's nice to have a actually just going [00:38:00] out and being drawn in.

Um, so every day can be a little bit of a surprise as to what you can find.

Dylan: Yeah,

Sacha: I thought the postal service very welcome. I both sent. And received posts. And when I received posts it had a stamp from another burn as well up from Queensland. Yeah. So there was this really nice intertextuality between the different events.

Dylan: Can I just say Roly? Roly won. Roly won Underland for me. He was on my field team and he was one of the quietest, most resourceful, most productive, most most engaging people that I've ever met.

Jenny: Yes. So he has done the postbox in Queensland and somehow bought it all the way down here. And then, you know, there were things like, um, it's amazing.

There was somebody who was cooking oysters. So Jamie was cooking oysters, um, I'm trying to remember the name. Uni Peak Hotel. Uni Peak. So you'd, he'd be out on, on the paddock at night and like using a blow torch to cook up oysters, kill Patrick. Uh, there was all sorts of [00:39:00] amazing things going on.

Stevan: Did anyone get trapped at the hippie trap?

Lydea: I gonna say, did anybody encounter the badger? He was a finely dressed gentleman with a top hat, with butterflies flying around it, and he was handing out. Um, compliments on, on beautiful business cards. Um, received a compliment. Did you?

Sacha: I believe I received a compliment.

Lydea: Did you do that? I love that. One. One well related to being like,

Sacha: nice avocado.

Lydea: What was it? Meeting you is like finding the perfectly right. Timely avocado in a grocery store because those things Oh,

Sacha: I felt amazing.

Dylan: There you go. Yeah, yeah, because those things are like,

Lydea: I think it's the nicest thing you can probably say to anybody.

Dylan: They're eight seconds and then they're gone.

Lydea: You'll be brown by then and

Dylan: Yeah.

Lydea: Light squidgy.

Dylan: Yeah, but I won't see you tomorrow.

Yeah, yeah. This is, this is the right here, right there.

Lydea: I gonna say every one underland for me. It's, it's Dylan who, um, I, um, [00:40:00] can I tell a little story, Dylan, about the effigy? So I had, um, gone to Underland for a while and watched all those hippies running around the fire going, oh, I, I wanna do that, I wanna do that.

I've gotta build up my body positivity. And, um, finally this year I was like, Nope. Yep. This is the year I'm loving myself. I'm feeling the energy I'm running around that fire. And that gorgeous snake sort of went up beautifully. And then the perimeter dropped and nobody came forward. And I'm like, what's going on?

What happened? And um, I'm like, God, I'm gonna have to start this. And none of my camp wanted to do it. So I was walking around the perimeter, running into people I knew going, Hey, come on, drop your Dax. Come with me. And they were like, oh, I'd love to, but I don't wanna go first. And as I walked past, I spotted Dylan and I had met Dylan at [00:41:00] the Burning pub, just the one before Underland.

And he'd told me that he'd built the effigy. So I thought, right, I'm gonna change tack here. And I've gone up to Dylan and I've gone, dude, what are you doing? You're the architect. It's tradition. You've gotta start the run. Everybody's waiting for you. And um, and I was like, do, do. No, I'm right there with you.

I'll go with you and we'll do it together. So, um, yeah, Dylan won Underland for me by donning his clothes and streaking out there. And him and I,

Dylan: yeah, well I did. There was, there was a precursor, Lydea, I jumped out in my undies and I said, I hear this is a tradition and if it isn't, it fucking now

Lydea: I tell you, Dylan off the crowd, ran around

Dylan: the fire.

Lydea: Look, I can't honestly say there's seven and a half billion people or something out there, isn't there? I can't [00:42:00] honestly say that's not a tradition somewhere. Um, but it is in Underland. Definitely is. Now you and me, babe.

Dylan: Such a revelatory moment. That was, it was such a revelatory moment. Yeah, because I was, I was, as I said before, when it was burning, I was in just mm-hmm.

This ecstasy and you know, I get around the house nude normally and I thought, yep, okay. Fuck it. Yeah. And I was out there, I did a lap and then I was joined by about 35 people, almost instantly.

Lydea: These were professionals. They had easy, naked, hiding behind people ready to

go.

Dylan: Someone start. Suit. It was really great.

Lydea: Velcro.

Dylan: Yeah, yeah. Like stripper suits to rip them off all of the, it was a very funny moment after all of the dancing. And this was a real, this was a really, this was really great actually. There were, [00:43:00] I don't know, maybe 50 or 60 nude people standing around talking to people who were dressed and Rhea, who was on the fire team in her full oxygen mask tank with gloves and masks and, you know, completely flammable fucking suits and boots and stuff.

She says, I'm standing there naked. She's standing there in the full protective kit, and she says, hug. I'm like, yep. So I give her a hug and we're standing in front of exactly the same fire and I'm like, hang on, do you know something? I don't like something gonna happen.

Lydea: Yeah. I think it's a, a beautiful part of the burn.

I think it really helps the shed, all of that stuff that society puts on us. Um, I had one person who I was trying to get to go out with me earlier, come up to me naked, as you said, and just say, look, you know, I've always been so body ashamed and so reluctant to show anybody, you know, lights off in the bedroom kind of thing.

And this is a beautiful creature who is talking to me. [00:44:00] Um, and yeah, yeah. The euphoria, the joy that they were feeling to be so free.

Dylan: Yeah.

Lydea: That's, yeah. It's, that's what that is about.

Dylan: Yeah.

Lydea: Yeah. I was getting high fives and

Dylan: the generosity of everyone in that crowd is just so, so

Lydea: funny. Or low fives.

Dylan: Yeah. Yeah.

Or low fives

Lydea: that could

Stevan: Did it feel like you were part of a cult?

Dylan: It was really, no, not at all. Not at all. In a cult, everyone walks around smiling and there were lots of people who were like, you know, not smiling, but, but still having a great time. We don't all have the same message. I tell you what, I think the difference between the, the effigy burn and the temple burn was really significant for me.

The, the kind of the, the, you know, celebratory kind of euphoria of the effigy compared to the quite Solomon silence, um, burn of the temple [00:45:00] was, was, was really, was really profound. 'cause I spent a bit of time in the temple. I wrote out lots. I cried like a fucking baby. I had a really wonderful experience where I had been in there and, and, and written lots of messages to, you know, people deceased and people still alive, both, all of whom I love.

And then I found myself just sitting on this, on, on that kind of like. To the right hand side, crying. And, um, a fellow came up who was clearly part of the Underland crew, and he just came and he sat down next to me and just said, Hey, you know, and he didn't, he didn't really say anything for a while and he said, I'm here, you know, if you wanna talk, talk.

And I did. And it was amazing. I didn't know this guy, and he was just so open and brilliant. It was really, it was really profound for me. The other significant thing that happened for me at underlay this year is that I finally managed to delete my dad from my contacts on my phone. He died five years ago, [00:46:00] and I finally got the courage to deleting off my favorites.

Oh, wow. Man, I'm, this is a big moment.

Stevan: Yeah. The, the tempo is quite a unique part of our culture, our burn our landscape. It's, you, you, you probably won't find that in, in, in any festivals or, or gatherings.

Dylan: Yeah. It was a brilliant invitation for vulnerability and for letting go, you know? So I did that. Yeah.

Sacha: So the physical and the social infrastructure exists in response to needs in the community. That's why we'll keep changing. That's why it's also so powerful. Especially after we have the burn and we've all been squeezed like a sponge to come out the other side of that temple. This apollonian silent spiritual collective witnessing and release.

I think, I think of the, the whole thing is a bit of like a palindrome where it's front to back is almost the same, but you have to go through the middle. And it's a, it's a very much a constructed ritual that we are constructing [00:47:00] and reconstructing and re-imagining. Where will we go next? What do we need?

Dylan: Who am I? Where you need to know who you are before you can really say what you need. That and look,

Lydea: I think that's where Burn is was a great, it was profoundly different. Um, I do have people who are like, you know, oh look, I can go to dance parties and bush, you know, and, and do all that here. Why should I go out and camp for days and put all this effort into building stuff and be in this harsh environment?

And I'm always like, because you should go out and camp for days. Um, build all this stuff and put yourself in this harsh environment. 'cause it is a place where you will find so many parts of yourself. Yeah. You may not have known were there or you may have forgotten about. Um, I think it can deconstruct us back to who we were when we first started out getting rid of those layers of cultural sort of oppression or [00:48:00] even just.

Conformity. And that doesn't happen naturally. That happens because people are holding space like that guy did for you, Dylan, because there's a place I did the same. I was up there for two, three hours I think. Yeah. Um, processing a lot of trauma that had happened this year. And I go there for that. And, um, there's not many places in the world, let alone just at say, Bush doofs or warehouse raves where you can do that.

And you can be surrounded by people who, uh, uh, giving you that permission and encouragement. And on the other side of that, we come out with our craziness as, as, as the pal and drivers, as Sacha was saying. Hmm.

Stevan: Yeah, that temple was quite impactful that even one of our community members in, in, in the burn community got a tattoo of the temple that it, that it, uh, [00:49:00] resonated with them.

Dylan: Yeah, it was really interesting 'cause I, I had met Aaron during the build phase and on a couple of calls and we hadn't really coordinated anything at all, but the temple and the effigy both rotated in the same direction. They had really similar kind of energy. There was kind of a, it was almost like this was all straight lines and geometry and mine was not a single straight line to be seen and geometry, but they had this kind of Kundalini energy going up, both of them.

That was really, it was really powerful. I was, I was really struck by it. We were both really thrilled when we saw how, you know, unplanned the connection between them was, was, was really profound. It was, it was great.

Jenny: I was really excited to be able to experience the, um, temple burn this year because last year, um.

It was on the Sunday night as it was this year, but school holidays ended the next day, so parents had to leave. Oh, right. It was school aged kids. So I had experienced an effigy burden, and [00:50:00] actually last year I took my clothes off and ran around naked, which also is not so something that I typically do, uh, not something I typically do at the supermarket and so forth.

Um, but this year I got to experience that very different energy and that collective awe and collective moment of pause. And I don't think we do that enough as a society is actually, genuinely stop and breathe and hold space. So, um, you know, it's, it's part of the beauty and inclusiveness of this community.

Um, another thing about burns I really like is that I think it's, it's inclusive for different kinds of people and that there's lots of fires to sit around and there's lots of things you can do. Like I think that something like do culture is, is really great for extroverts and introverts that like to dance, but the people that are sort of between those two extremes, you know, this is, there's so many places to sit and have a conversation with whoever's next to you and everybody is open to that.

So it's, it's, um, it's a, it's welcoming. Um, I mean it's not [00:51:00] perfect, but it is, it is a welcoming.

Stevan: Can we talk about the burnable art on Friday night? That was a surprise. Kinda stealth burn.

Jenny: Yeah. Um, that was very special piece, um, that was done. So it was an art grant and it needed, um, you know, a whole lot of extra participation from the, um, from Benji who's the burning lead to make it come together.

So the artist's name is Chelsea, and she had created this, it was called, uh, timber Stars for Jill. And so she'd actually created something that looked like it was made for wood, but it looked like, um, it was an ode to a quilt. And her mother had died the year before and she'd made a lot of quilts, put quilts for people who were, um, you know, women in domestic violence shelters and things like this.

So, so, uh, Chelsea's concept was to design something that was reminiscent and an ode to her mother, and then they had a small burn, um, for that piece as part of her. Um, as part of her artwork. Uh, so yeah, it was really special [00:52:00] and, and in, and it was collaborative in the sense that the wraparound support needed to make that happen, uh, was happily contributed by the people who had skills in fire safety and, you know, all of those elements.

Stevan: Is this something that you, that you think we'll see more of in the future, for burnable arts?

Jenny: Uh, I think that the, yeah, look, I, I think that the in we need, it needs to, if the process needs to be looked at, I know there, there was, uh, somebody who emailed right after, right after Underland with, with an art concept.

That was something that was a day again, uh, something, uh, burnable. And, um, I, I think it, we just have to be sure that we have enough people with fire skills and that they have enough time. Um, it was still quite stretched in all. In many ways in terms of resources, even though we grow each year. But there's also, uh, more and more, uh, you know, there's lots of people who love fire.

And so people who have fire blasting components to their art.

Lydea: Mm-hmm.

Jenny: Um, uh, there's a [00:53:00] certain little fire loving side to burners, obviously, if you look at the name. Uh, so I think that the answer is, is yes. It may not always be, it was an amazing piece, separate piece that burns, but, sorry, go on. Um, yeah, I think there's a love and fire.

Um, well, did people get Oh yes. It was an amazing piece. Well, I was also thinking about, um, Anaya, which was a piece, uh, that was Yeah. Where you looked mirror, so you had two people stood opposite and you saw part

Stevan: that was great,

Jenny: your, yourself and partly the person opposite.

Stevan: Yeah, that was a great piece. Yeah.

Jenny: Yeah. It was, it was really fantastic. It was out, out in the paddock. You had to go find it. And, and, uh, it was, um, sparked by a trip someone did that year to Iran and, um, you know, had a poem in Farsi in English. It was created by one of, one of the, um, artists. And it was just a lovely piece. And that was somebody that, the lead artist was somebody who hadn't led an art project previously.

Certainly has said a lot of things at Burns, but it's exciting to get art grads from people who are stepping in new directions.

Stevan: And did anyone check out the Sin City Dome [00:54:00] activation or the visual projections? They're amazing, trippy,

Jenny: beautiful artwork. Yeah. There was an art on all sorts of scale. Did anybody see Value of The Dolls, which was a box of Mm.

Great old school tv and it had all of these, these legs in it, all party legs. That was great. It was just really cool the way there's this small and large art and you could so easily start something.

Lydea: I spent hours on that seesaw

Jenny: or just miss it all together.

Stevan: The fairy bloom. Yeah. Fantastic.

Jenny: Was a lot of work that was supposed to, that was, its inaugural. Um, outing. It was supposed to go to, um, burning Seed this year, which was canceled. And uh, it was a lot of work for Glenn to get that working and lots of chipping in, lots of people collaborating. Uh, and it the way

Lydea: Yay

Jenny: spectacular.

Stevan: And we had two art cars, uh, Uki and, uh, the K-Sub,

Jenny: yeah, two classic art cars. It was very cool to have those ones there.

Stevan: Yeah. This is their last hurrah the last year of, uh, of the K sub.

Jenny: So they say,

Stevan: do you know what they they're doing with it?

Jenny: I think that the storage costs and the, you know, the, the, the [00:55:00] crew has been doing it for, um, I don't know, prob maybe 10 years or something.

And there's, they've, you know, so I think it's become difficult, but I, I'm not sure we'll see whether, whether it, it's somehow a, an affordable home is found and it makes a resurgence or not, but it certainly, you know, the, um, the piece that they did this year where they had all of the sub stops and lots of performances and uh, you know, it was just fantastic.

I got to be part of a dance. I was a squid, you know, I was like, put it at the last minute. I'm like, great. They're really desperate. Had a great time. Um, yeah, it was, um, it was great to see new, new music camps, new artists, and then some classic, um, classic burners coming up. You know, some of the old older school pieces.

Lydea: There's some fantastic traditions as burns as well. So like the, um. They were playing the dark side of the moon to the, the film of a Wizard of Oz. And it's a, that is a beautiful sort of, [00:56:00]

Dylan: is that when Positeka turned their stereo on for the first time? Because I was in the crew camp and heard this sound and I was just like, where is that coming from?

I was, I was drawn like a moth to the flame.

Lydea: Yeah. The movie was at center Camp.

Dylan: Extraordinary.

Stevan: That was at center camp. Yeah. A AJ provided the sound system for Center Camp as well. So that's why you get the clarity.

Dylan: Yeah. Yeah. Well AJ is, AJ is the sound God? Definitely a sound God.

Stevan: What about some of the, uh, the food events?

Did you

Lydea: I got the low and slow.

Stevan: Did anyone go out and get some in xs breakfast snack, a clock?

Lydea: That was,

Dylan: I got the low and slow.

Sacha: I had the low and slow delivered to my shift at center camp.

Stevan: Mm

Lydea: ooh.

Dylan: Special.

Jenny: I have to say low and low and slow. Saved me one night before the burn. I got taken there. It got a delicious feed.

Dylan: I was a bit spoiled. I took lots of food 'cause I was gonna be there for like 12 days 'cause I had to do it, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But when I turned up at the crew camp, it was this most incredible team cooking for everyone. And like [00:57:00] I would be wandering home at like three o'clock in the morning and they're still there going, oh, would you like a burrito?

And I'm like, yeah, I'll have a burrito.

Jenny: Totally. The, the cooking for spam was so good and I was so grateful to coattail in on that deal.

Dylan: Oh, it was amazing. I had no idea that it was even gonna be pre provided. So I,

Jenny: you know, you really needed a briefing, Dylan, like, seriously, but everyone, seriously,

Dylan: I felt like everyone just thought, oh yeah, you've won the effgy.

Jenny: Absolutely.

Dylan: You must know what these are about. You are into this. I had no idea.

Sacha: I think it's important to note that burns aren't the most efficient way of doing things. So these inefficiencies are part of it. You came with everything you needed and then you found abundance.

Dylan: Yeah, I survived. I ended up contributing most of my food to the, to the, to the spam kitchen.

Perfect. Like, you know, I've, I've got all this food, can, where do I put it?

Lydea: I full use of sanctuary this year with a taste and cheese could something amazing soup. And the, and, [00:58:00] um, that was, um, joyous.

Sacha: It's great. They offer food to give people a nice, easy way to attend.

Jenny: I gotta be on site for like nine days.

Uh, it was just such a treat to be there that long, to be in nature, to watch something grow, to watch it pack down. There was one morning when I accidentally stayed up till dawn, um, hanging out in Poca after the music ended and I went back and, uh, we camp, we camp back in the trees and I was sitting outside the caravan and their, I got to experience their cacophony where all the birds were all just falling, not even to each other.

They were just separate layer layer. Burn sound. Mm. And that getting to be a nature like that was just an absolute treat. To me. That was, that was one of my highlights.

Dylan: Yeah. Sanctuary was really good for me too. I had, I had a morning where I was feeling really just, I think it was after the effigy had burnt and I went in there feeling a little fragile and scarlet mm-hmm.

Gave me chocolate and a cup of tea and a hug and I was just like, yeah. Great.

Lydea: I think, um, you've highlighted [00:59:00] a point though that I, I'm sure will all as beautiful burners, um, get onto this year. Um, it was a huge uptake in fresh new burners. Um, I, when I did sanctuary training this year, there was a beautiful, a number of new burners there like heaps, which is fantastic to have those volunteers there first year into a burn.

Um, and I just made a comment on the WhatsApp group. Anybody wants to chat to me, have questions, I'll start a conversation in a different group. And I got probably about 20 people in the group. And yeah, they really didn't know anything about a burn. They didn't know about the effigy or the temple. They didn't know about, um, the sort of things, what to expect.

Some didn't know that they needed to bring their own fruit and drink. So I think as a community we need to [01:00:00] sort of. Think about that and help guide those people to the survival guide at the wet way when, or create different ways that we can communicate, um, to help people understand what they're getting themselves in for.

Um, I've done a lot of, yeah. I like, I've done a lot of sanctuaries in different places. Yes, definitely onboarding, onboarding improvements and what I know this is the biggest people coming in having emotional difficulties, uh, are largely the free campers who aren't camping with. They may be one, one or two people.

They may even have come on their own. And so they don't have the support. And look, we just had a, a renegade camp this year. Yeah. Toad Hall will be coming back officially in 20, well, 20, 26 this year I should say. Hey. And it's the least we could do. It's the least we can do, isn't it, Sacha? You. Um, but I, it's the least we could do encouraged.

And we had, I think [01:01:00] three or four people or so who were new burners said, come and camp next to us. You know, use our comfy facilities, use our kitchen facilities, but also just, you know, we are here. So that you've got space that is, feels homely and safe, and we are here to support you and guide you and do whatever you need.

And, um, so yeah, as a community for, I'm gonna certainly encourage that we continue to be aware of our new newbies because, uh, they're, they're a delight. There's nothing more joyous than sharing something for the first time with someone. Mm.

Dylan: Yeah. Like, well, I must, I might be a virgin, but because I was with the spam crew, I was instantly welcomed and supported, and connected to, to all sorts of things.

Except how, except what the hell was gonna go on. From, from when, when the thing started.

Jenny: Yeah. And I'm forever spruiking [01:02:00] under land. I try to bring across the, the good doofers, the ones, you know, the ones that, that know it, get it, live it, love it. And, uh, I just, it's so, it's like there's, we're gonna have gender equality before we have all the good doofers at burn.

So we, you know, we need, don't say that you've gotta grow this well, we've gotta grow this. We're excited to grow this with this, this, it's still new in Victoria. We can still mold it, you know, and, um, more ticket sales means more art grants. So I'm, I'm all keen to get, you know, to bring those people across who actually know how to do an outdoor party or how to bring a vibe or who are creative, who are looking for community.

Just, you know, get them over the line. I dunno why it's so hard. Actually, they're very convincing.

Dylan: One of the things that I've sort of like, 'cause in, in, in, in little catch-ups afterwards and at a couple of burning parks and, you know, parties that I've been to, whether are people who I've met at Underland, you know, people are like, oh, what do you think?

You know, how, what can we do? And I'm really intrigued at how it [01:03:00] is that we can once, once they're there, Jen, because I know it takes a while to get there, but how do you give people tools to utilize the kinds of things that are going on in that community? The normal world, do you know what I mean? So it doesn't feel like you are in the normal world and then you're in the burner community and it's really great.

And then you go back to the normal world and you have to do things differently. What are the, what are the kind of tools to bring about some of that generosity and some of some of those things that we, we celebrate in that community to to to to, to larger communities that maybe helps eventually bring those people that, that dunno about it.

Sacha: Perhaps we could,

Jenny: I can't wait to attend your workshop next year, Dylan on that can do. with Jaes.

Dylan: My, my workshop this year, uh, I, I had an idea. I wanna, I wanna do a hug school, um, because I'm a really great hugger. But, but you know, I, I also meet people who don't really know how to do it. And I think I'm gonna do it all as a comedy routine.

And it's gonna be really, it's gonna be like a hug school where [01:04:00] you get a certificate and you, you can learn how to, like, what does consent look like.

Lydea: I think these are great ways to sort of raise awareness.

Jenny: That's great. Could do that in the caberet next year.

Lydea: That's a great opportunity to have a little mini consent convo happening with the free Hugs workshop.

You know, and it can be, and they can be great ways. Even doing the Spanking Police out on the paddock this year, it was supporting the moot patrol. Sometimes it was going through people's camps and just dealing out on the spot fines. You know, they hadn't quite got their camp in order and such. Like, it can be a great way to educate using that fun.

But I hear what you're saying, Dylan, about how do we bring it and keep it in our day-to-day lives. 'cause I am more and more living by the 10 principles all the time. Mm-hmm.

Dylan: Which is an interesting kind of segue to, to this year's theme of threshold. It's like, how do we, how do we dissolve [01:05:00] those? How do we celebrate them?

But also,

Lydea: yeah,

Dylan: also kind of point out that, you know, art exists everywhere, not just in a gallery. And, and how do we kind of get that community spirit into our day to day?

Lydea: Ooh.

Sacha: Perhaps we could hear some recordings from some of the first timers about their community spirit.

Dylan: What a great idea.

Stevan: Okay. Let's, let's take a break.

Let's take a quick break, short break. Uh, after this, let's get into the participation side of, uh, what of the 10 principles, um, why do we do it, and what's the value? What, what does it mean to the community? So we'll get into the breakdown of those conversations after the short break.

Katie: Uh, thank you. Hello, my name's Katie.

I'm from Melbourne, sort of, uh, sort of from England as well. Uh, I love this place. I love the, uh, permission for everybody to come and be disinhibited and weird and to feel extremely safe to do that. And everyone is welcome to just [01:06:00] drop all of the normal expectations of society that are normally constraining everyone and can just basically be a, a toddler again.

And it's absolutely wonderful and I love it. Uh, so keeping weird everyone. Love you. Bye.

Erin: My name's Erin. I'm from Melbourne. I've got two kids, which I've brought to the festival. Uh, the burner community for me is the most inclusive and the most amazing, um, doof community that I've ever attended. And it's creativity and it's what everyone else brings to it.

It's positive and it's all about inspiring each other to, to create something together. It's awesome. Get into it.

Ottermamma: Hey family. This is Otter Mama from currently in Australia. I just wanna say I love our family, our community. It's my happy place. It's a space that we all can be completely who we are. [01:07:00] And thank you all for just shining 'cause your brightness ignites my fire.

Let's keep burning together. Love youse.

Kyler: Hello, my name is Kyler. I am from, uh, Melbourne. And Underland for me is just an absolute delight for the senses, the colors, the sparkles, the creativity is, uh, really got me in a state of awe. So gracias. Thank you. Underland.

Tommy: Hi, Tommy C from Wodonga. Uh, I, I love this shit. Simple. It's the best. Ah, just such a good community, isn't it? Um, yeah, just the vibes and just the love.

Snoozing: Hi, my name's Belinda. I've currently on Sanctuary and with a couple of lovely folks, [01:08:00] and it's been a wonderful weekend. It's been so beautiful to part of the sanctuary space, which has been curated so thoughtfully and intentionally with everyone really committed to the wellbeing and supporting the wellbeing of, of those around us.

And. That's probably the thing that I love most about the burner community is that everyone looks out for each other. There's so many warm hearts and warm hugs and smiling eyes and sparkling faces.

Mm-hmm.

And it's been one of the most beautiful experiences of my life.

Ben: Hey, this is Ben, uh, I appreciate burns because [01:09:00] they are such a source of creative expression and, uh, freedom to explore and create and discover new things.

Tom: Oh, yep. Sure. Yeah, that's great. Uh, yeah, my name's Tom and I'm from Melbourne. And yeah, this is such just like a, a lovely community and it's so great to just be in the moment all the time. I mean, that, that's the most special thing. And uh, I think one thing I always look forward to coming to festivals is just appreciating the beauty that's always there that you don't really like recognize because you're just moving too fast or you're like in your head or you're worrying about the future or like worrying about the past.

But, um, yeah, it's just, uh, people being human art, which is amazing and I love it.

Stevan: Okay, welcome [01:10:00] back. Now, Dylan, you, you mentioned about onboarding new, new burners. How about something like a silly hat or a wristband? They, they can wear around and you can identify these, uh, new burners?

Dylan: Hi, I am new here.

I wanna, I don't know. I, that might, that, that might work in some ways. I think, I think the most important thing is letting people know that they're actually, that, that you can talk to anyone. I mean, I'm a pretty outgoing, kind of extroverted fellow, you know, when I'm in, when I'm in the flow. So I love saying a hello to people all the time.

So it worked really well for me because I just said hello to people. I think the biggest thing for me was I'm really crap at like, looking at documents on my phone because I'm basically blind, so I have to put my glasses on. And so it was the, the, um, what went where document, whilst it had lots of information in it, lot wasn't at all, it, it didn't have any tiered information.

And so I was like, pages, [01:11:00] pages of stuff that I had to zoom in on to try and even understand. And I just was like, oh God, I can't even, I can't even go there. I just ask people what's happening. So

Lydea: it's always a challenge of what, where, when, and we've got a really tiny one compared to. To many others.

Dylan: I imagine.

Lydea: I think the best one I ever saw had, um, the ability to sort of flag or save things you were sort of interested in. Um,

Dylan: yeah, yeah. Or like load up to your calendar so that at least your phone was going, oh, you are interested in this. It's happening.

Lydea: But I think what theme camps can definitely think of or anybody running an event is, what can I do organically just to draw punters who are walking past, um, what can I have that lets them know that there's an event going on?

Uh, Toad Hall usually has a space. Toad Hall is a, a theme camp. We ran with the Fantastic Space Cake about three, three years ago, and we are bringing it back this year. But [01:12:00] one of the things that was handy was just having our own little board that said this event is today at this time, as this time. Um,

Dylan: it's a Toad Hall from Wind in the Willows.

So like, you know, you go,

Lydea: it's, we're a bunch of silly gooses and weasels. Um, yeah, I'd love to maybe take the opportunity to let you guys know what it'll bring. Um,

Stevan: what's the appeal of Renegade Theme Camps? What do you guys don't wanna be on the, um, WTF?

Lydea: Um, generally I would say for this one, it is, for me it was a point of ignition.

Um, so it badger my, my husband and I, um, have this concept and idea. It is that whimsical childhood king into the steampunk aesthetic. Also tying into that Victorian era that's very, oh, it's all nice and straight laced up front, but in the back it gets, you know, this is, you know, this [01:13:00] is the great binge

Dylan: Glory Holes.

Lydea: Gets a little weird. Um, so, but we put it out there as a renegade camp for a couple of years and slowly drew in people who were again, into that same aesthetic and loved that concept. And then last year we, the group we had drawn around us, we've, we got people coming and going, Hey, I'd like to do this. Do you think I can do it with you guys?

And we have finally got that official group together to actually put it officially back on the paddock, which we will do this year. Um, we'll bring, uh, a series of events. Some of them will be pg, some of them will be not so much

Dylan: NSFW,

Lydea: and um, and hopefully bring back our traditional low tea, which is our boozy tea based cocktail served in [01:14:00] the Tea Potts that we did the first year that we ran it.

So expect more things to come. There will definitely be a story time. You've heard Sacha's voice. He sounds like he should be on BBC radio.

Stevan: Okay, let's talk about the participation side of the burn of the event. Now, with participation, there's also communal effort. And civic responsibility as part of the principles.

Uh, do they compliment each other? And what's your, what's your involvement? What's your take on how the burn runs?

Jenny: I think there's, um, it's really interesting. There's so much work that goes on behind the scenes in the lead up, you know, and you've got Community Arts Victoria, um, you know, obviously they've got, um, I dunno what they call themselves, management committee.

But then they, all the theme camps have all of their, you know, have all of their organizational groups and then they have fundraisers. I mean, there's huge amount of work that goes on before anybody even hits a paddock. And then there's setting up and then, but then during the event, there's so many different ways you can get involved.

And I think that this signup [01:15:00] form is going to be improved for, you know, making sure that people, uh, choose some sort of volunteering. I mean, I've done greeting last year, um, um, you know, requires being enthusiastic. Um, that's a match for me. I've been part of a group kitchen last year. Know there's so much you can do.

There's bar shifts, there's moop shifts as you know, as well as there's always chipping in and you can end up at a burn, just feeling like you're running from one shift to another. You've gotta go, you've gotta be somewhere, you've gotta keep an eye on the time. And that's quite a nice way to do a burn. And it's quite nice to also have a burn where a lot of your workers happen before you get there and you kind of get to enjoy yourself.

So I think those can be two, the two ends of the spectrum. And there's many points in between.

Lydea: Yeah, I agree. And again, I think we will as a communities. Reach out to our new burners to, to help them understand what those opportunities are and what those rewards are. Um, I certainly know it's just a, a f.[01:16:00]

Fast track to getting connected, um, to everybody that's there. Um, I think many people who I talk to, their first experience of a burn is to be sometimes somewhat isolated. Like there seems to be a whole heap of really best friends here are all talking to each other, and I don't know any of them.

Everybody knows everybody here, and it's like, no, we don't know everybody. We just will talk to everybody. So I think volunteering is one of the. Best ways to osmosis that education and, and have those more seasoned burners around you to go, Hey, no, go try this. Go taste that. Pitch your tongue over there.

Stick your finger in that. And, um, yeah. So I think encouraging people, letting them know that you're not gonna bite off more than you can chew. We, we are here to support your burn and you give it, but

Dylan: no one's gonna shoot you down.

Lydea: Nobody's gonna shoot you down. Nobody's gonna go, Hey, you know what, you're just on for the [01:17:00] next 24 hours.

'cause nobody else has turned up. It's, um, you can give as much as you, you can and it gives you so much, you know, in the words of Mother Theresa, it gives you so much more back than your giving, um, in community connection.

Stevan: And what's your advice, Dylan, for first time burners?

Dylan: Um, read the where, what, when, earlier than when you arrive.

Um, have, just, just go in with a really open heart because no one's gonna laugh at you. They laugh with you, no one's gonna shoot you down. It's a very, very generous, generous and intelligent community. And I just. I would, I would highly recommend it to those people who are looking for connection. The connection is really, really amazing and it, it, it carries on, you know, it's, it's kind of designed for me 'cause I feel like it's a little bit like I've found my people [01:18:00] and, you know, contribute that, that there's no, there's no bad ideas.

There's no stupid things. And, and I, and I love that because I use humor a lot in my work to kind of draw people outta their shells and play a lot. And it's a place for play, but intelligent play, you know, intelligent and, um, purposeful play. So I really, I, I couldn't recommend it more to anybody who's, who's, you know, hunting for that, you know, sense of connection and participation.

Lydea: I see that thirst in so many people like, um, who don't sort of burn. You see that in, um, adults there's severe lack of play, um, and trying to communicate or connect it sometimes through their children or, and trying to get other adults involved in something, even if it's a basic. Video game or something and, and just not getting any traction.

And it's like play is, is, is, is really hard to find in the default world.

Dylan: Mm-hmm.

Jenny: I reckon it's [01:19:00] the elixir abuse too, I think, you know? Mm-hmm. It keeps you young, keeps you looking young. It keeps you feeling young. It is the secret. Secret

Dylan: Keeps you thinking. Yeah.

Jenny: Yeah.

Dylan: And you know, there's, there's a, there's, there's no, there's no shame in, in any of, in any of the conversations, experiences.

And, you know, whilst there's always politics, politics is coming around 'cause everybody wants great things to happen. I remember I was in the red tent next to the, um, next to the post office watching the, um, flight crew do their pre-show briefing. And I remember listening to these radically intelligent, articulate people, navigate through self-organization in a way that I just thought, oh my God, if, if, if corporations could, could behave like this.

They would be vastly different. There was no hierarchy other than the strength of idea and the, you know, the, the, the joke or the laugh or the, or [01:20:00] the, or the purposeful point. And I was in awe of, of, of the men and women in that group clearly, you know, making decisions and prioritizing things and, and working in a way that I was just like, this is really different.

This is a really different way to be. And it was, and it really struck me try and bring a little bit of that into my work now, to, you know, kind of make the conversations flow like that rather than hierarchically or, you know, sort of, you know, who's the boss and who's being told what to do. Draw people into that kind of, how might we do this?

What might be a good thing? Does, can anyone think of anything we've missed? You know, it's really, it's really vital, vital stuff.

Sacha: One of the conversations from the Burning Man project is about how what is happening in a burn is less of a hierarchy and more similar to the workshop model, studio model, say, say the Renaissance, where artists are learning together and sharing skills with [01:21:00] some guidance.

But this structure allows us all to build and to inspire each other. Every system has its issue with freeloaders, no matter what the system is. But our answer seems to be to inspire them to be like, oh, I didn't get it. I want to do more next year.

Dylan: Mm. Yeah. There was, there's, there's very little white anting hanging on.

There's no, there's, it was, it was full contribution. Full open, open minds. And I, I was, I was really struck.

Sacha: If the question was what should new people do, then I'd say join a team for a couple of teams.

Dylan: Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. But, and, and volunteer, you know, into, into theme camps and, you know, turn, even if you turn up and go, Hey, what can I do?

You know,

Sacha: and the theme comes as a popular one, but I'm gonna shout out once again, for the civic infrastructure, I never focused so much on theme camps, myself

Dylan: and the effigy team. The effigy team's always looking

Sacha: for That's true. That's one of the civic infrastructures. But getting to know a burn by being a Ranger, which was one of my first [01:22:00] teams, was amazing.

Lydea: Yeah.

Sacha: Learning the, everyone at the burn by being a greeter is fantastic.

Dylan: Mm. Yeah.

Sacha: Creating those deep relationships at sanctuary or center camp, joining a theme camp is a very valid way of doing it. But there's so many different pathways.

Lydea: I, I think it's, you know, would it definitely encourage people to in fact, look at doing both?

Like, I don't think they're mutually exclusive, being part of a theme camp. You can, you do still need to be part of the civic infrastructure.

Sacha: Mm.

Lydea: Um,

Stevan: there are some burns that initiate that. Kind of, uh, it's, well, yeah, kind of participation where although you're part of a theme camp, you still need to, you know, um, do a few shifts here and there.

Mm-hmm. Whether, whether it's sanitary, sanitation, sanctuary rangers, medics, or, and these are enrich, really qualified in as well.

Lydea: Yeah.

Stevan: Yeah.

Lydea: Look, I've,

Stevan: it is part of a community, community building as well, which is what I want to talk about is, is that, um, uh, part of our [01:23:00] whole, I guess, community and culture is, is based on that.

Lydea: And I've been to Burns where theme camps won't sort of accept you unless you've got a couple of shifts under your belt. You know, they're just, um, again, everybody has different culture and different ways of approaching these, these sort of dynamics. But, um, yeah, I'm now sanctuary because sanctuary's been there for me.

Um, and the pe people in the burn have been there to, for me, the first one I went to. And for the, there, for the first time of my life and not being adulty ha being able to play and have no responsibility, I just started having panic attacks. Like my brain was going, no, you have problems woman. You know what, what is, what is this fuckery that you were that was doing?

You know, it was bizarre.

Dylan: Get these some responsibility,

Lydea: get these some panic, um, and people would say, Hey, how you doing? And I turn around and I went, I'm not [01:24:00] okay. And they turn around and they held space and they listened and they cared and they gave me some Valium, whatever else they may have had. Um, and that changed my entire experience of a burn.

That it's like, as you said, oh wow, this is a whole bunch of people. This is not a normal festival when nobody care and nobody has any responsibility. Everybody here cares. Everybody feels responsible. Um, and it genuinely gives you that space where you just wanna go. I wanna be part of that system. And I agree, Sacha, shout out to ranging.

It is the best way to get to know the burn and everybody in it. And a wonderful way to start volunteering and greeter and gate both. But I know we had a new person on the perimeter this year and I believe their experience was really enriched by it and, um, props for them for doing that.

Jenny: And we know that there's also, um, you know, there's still like quite a lot of.

Males in [01:25:00] spam, or we need women to go in there and wanna be part of that and half the time, but it's an opportunity to gain some skills. You know, a lot of these different areas of volunteering, you actually get skilled up. You can learn some things along the way.

Dylan: Yep.

Jenny: Uh, so it's, you know, it is definitely reciprocal.

Lydea: There's, yeah, there's a great opportunity there too that we can maybe, um, talk to theme camps and spam about. This could be a potential internship for skills. There are sound systems getting built. There are visual things. These are, you know, fantastic skills to learn for many industries. Um, even as I said, the logistics of kitchen or hygiene, there are all ways to learn new skills.

Stevan: Uh, speaking of common arts, Victoria, uh, there's piece of updates, uh, with them. Some of the talking points was surrounding the extension of Underland and for an extra day,

Dylan: starting on my birthday. [01:26:00]

Lydea: It's not all about you, Dylan.

Dylan: Oh, I dunno. I dunno. Lydea Universe clearly presenting an opportunity here.

Lydea: Oh my God, I know.

Next year

Dylan: I'm throwing a party.

Lydea: Next year,

Dylan: seven of my closest friend

Lydea: next year's ever's gonna be a giant statue of Dylan, isn't it?

Dylan: No. I would never submit that.

Lydea: Well, I heard the effigy was phallic. I'm just asking, is it true to scale, Dylan?

Dylan: Yeah, absolutely. But more importantly, true to energy. I remember somebody, somebody came up to me and said, oh, that's just a, somebody, people are saying that's just a giant penis. And I was like, I was honestly shocked. I hadn't actually thought of it like that, but, but I said, okay, I'm gonna own that.

Yes, it's got a lot of sexual energy in it, but this is good dick, not crap dick. Right? So this is the anti Elon Musk dick. This is not a rocket ship fucking off. This is a serpent whose head is pointed at his satellites to say, [01:27:00] fuck you, Elon. That, and I think it's really important that, that, that there is a recognition that there are some really great men.

There are some really, you'd need great dick energy to fucking fight down the crap dick energy, because the crap, dick energy is just shitting on everything

Sacha: we shall overcome.

Lydea: I think there's a,

Dylan: we shall come over,

Stevan: boom, boom.

Lydea: There's a very marked difference between alpha male and toxic masculinity.

They're two separate things. One of them's fantastic, the other one not so much.

Dylan: Yeah, I don't even know if it's Alpha like, you know, that's always the, the, you know, beta is better than Alpha. 'Cause alpha's the really, you know, I don't need to lead and win and all that sort of stuff. But I love touch, I love intimacy.

I love, I love that kind of ability to be strong and gentle. You know, it's like I, I brought my boys up. To be good men. Men, they're great men, and more, we need more great men.

Stevan: And what do think about the extra day of camping?

Sacha: Everyone safe? They wanna hold space if they're not.

Dylan: Yeah, exactly. And, and, and, and, and strength is protection, not, not threat, [01:28:00] you know?

So from that point of view, yeah, it was a really sexy fucking effigy, you know? And it was, it was, it was a pleasure to build and make and have the team, which was equally men and women, build it with me. And to have such a tactilely, kind of writhing, amazing, amazing structure there that didn't, everyone was like, how the hell have you built this?

And so we left a lot of the scales off at the, at the base so you could see how it'd been made. Because otherwise it would've been just like sort of, you know, like it's a photocopier, like it's got an outside and who the fuck knows what's going on inside. And so we had to let people know how it'd been made.

It was really great,

Lydea: and I'll totally support that thought you said of it being a protective male energy in, I saw many people snuggled in the coils of the snake sitting there and chatting at all times of day and night. Just, um, sheltered from the wind.

Dylan: Yeah.

Lydea: Um, and it's loving coils.

Dylan: Yeah, it was really, I was, I felt [01:29:00] really, I was super thrilled at the gift that I could make and have, and have and create that space and create that fascination and still have a little bit of play in it.

Like the, the, the serpent's tongue, six meters in the air was made from a little timber snake that blew around in the wind. Like, you know, one of those little $6, 2 dollars 50 articulated snakes from Bunnings, nice little touches.

Stevan: So Jenni, if we're gonna burn the effigy on a Sunday, again with the extra day, would we be able to shift that earlier so people could actually enjoy and attend the Temple burn?

Jenny: Yeah, it's, it's, uh, it's an interesting one and I think there's a community conversation coming up about this. Um, you know, it's one of these things. So yeah, for parents, if it's the weekend in the middle of the school holidays, then it takes some pressure off. There are still other people that need to leave to get back to work.

I mean, we, we all take a bit of time off work and I can't imagine a better use for the leave than our employers grant us. But, you know, if you're gonna [01:30:00] move. The, you know, if you're gonna move the temple to Saturday night, then the effigy is Friday night. And then the question is, is there enough time for people to get to the event and feel immersed?

So you don't, you know, it, it, yeah, I think that, that the, that the idea of extended it would be to still, still do the temple on a Sunday, but still have, you know, Monday to, to really, nobody has to leave until Wednesday or Tuesday or whenever it is. I don't know. I'm gonna go to my first Burning Man and I'll report back as to how I go for a week.

Dylan: It's a full moon on the Sunday this year as well. So, you know, that's a, a little bit of

Lydea: pretty great temple burn.

Dylan: Little bit woo woo in there.

Lydea: I, I think the challenge would be with the energy as well, because the challenge, it will be also with the energy as well. Um, for many, it's a very cathartic process, the temple burn.

It's an exhausting process and it has that natural final feel to it. [01:31:00] Um, for me, I find I'm exhausted afterwards the next day and, and. It's it for, for me, it perfectly finishes what a burn is. It's the,

Dylan: it's a nice combination.

Lydea: Yes. Conclusion. Conclusion. It's, it's a, it's a down, wind down

Sacha: release is the final part of the ritual.

Lydea: It is, yeah. So I, I dunno what I would do if there was an extra day at the end, I'd probably start doing something awfully executive like.

Dylan: Like new burn resolutions.

Lydea: Yeah, it'd be terrible. I'd be making lists or something awful. And default,

Dylan: uh, the bass is due, right?

Lydea: Yes.

Stevan: Can anyone think of any other improvements or recommendations? What, what did you guys learn this year at, at Underland? What can we improve for next year?

Sacha: I'd like to host the, um, the [01:32:00] cabaret that I improvise, but host it in a more planned manner, um, either back at center camp or at Toad Hall.

Um, and on the Thursday, I think there's a bit of a gap on the Thursday of a low energy activity where you can still feel a bit of magic. Mm-hmm.

Lydea: Definitely. I I think it's growing. Definitely. I think it's growing beautifully. Watching it unfold since it started coming to it last year. It was an amazing growth.

And it just reminded me of that time, like in high school it was, I think the summer of grade nine, and then you come back for grade 10 and then all of a sudden, you know, all the guys suddenly have broad shoulders and, you know, chest hairs.

Dylan: Everybody wants have sex.

Lydea: Yes. And it's all, you know, hormones. Wow.

And it's just like, it felt like that. It's just like, wow, okay. We're in our teenage years now. Now the party starts. So I think it's growing beautifully. I think it's just, you know, the challenge of keeping the infrastructure going and we are limited by how many people are [01:33:00] volunteering. And more than anything, how many people are co-creating.

But where it's going is fun. I'd love to see and hear more voices. Um, I love that we've now got a family lead and inclusion. I'd love to see some more adult expression as well, and, and people's different point of views coming in. And that's growing with the Gaze and Auntie Marias and all the different style of camps that are coming.

So it is just get your voice out there, speak your truth and, and keep it growing and keep it, um, a kaleidoscope of different diverse people and ideas.

Dylan: Be nice. There's a, some of my friends who came at the last minute, they came and had been to a burn before, and so they came prepared to like set up a little dial station and like make doll for the entire time that they were there.

They didn't have like a tent or, or a place to do it, and they ended up sort of, [01:34:00] um, commandeering a, a gazebo. But it'd be really great if there was a way to say,

Lydea: oh yeah,

Dylan: you know, there's, there's a little, there's a little kind of, there's there's little nooks where popups could like come in and, and actually do a thing.

'cause

Sacha: always welcome at center camp.

Dylan: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I know. But, but like, imagine, imagine like little. A, a little place where people can go, like, you know, that's, that's, that's promoted to go, Hey, if you wanna do something on this day, come in, you can set up here. You can, you can do your thing. You don't need to bring all of the kit.

You don't need to have a crew to set something up. You don't, there's like, almost like in an expo for example, there are main pavilions and there are B grade pavilions that are built by the expo that other people can come and utilise if they don't have the funds or the resources to do something that,

Sacha: yeah.

So it's a question of centralized infrastructure versus people bringing the infrastructure they need to give their gift.

Dylan: Yeah. Yeah. But rather than centralizing, you know, 20 popups, what you do is you sprinkle them [01:35:00] through and you make them available to people to come and go, oh yeah, I've got, I wanna do this.

Okay, great. You can have, you know, set up in here and do this. I think there's also really great idea from cna, um, who's a foodie to kind of create. A bit of a central pre and after kitchen where there's, where you don't need to duplicate in every little place. Cooking facilities and, you know, rubbish and cleaning and doing all of that sort of stuff.

But there's a sort of a common kitchen, and I think that's something that he's very interested in bringing to Cav, which I think would be a remarkable opening up of the opportunities for people to actually do really great sort of things that, that, that are supported by a, by a cooking and also a waste stream capture so that your, your, you know, all of your waste is coming back to a central place and can be composted and, and, and dealt with in a really smart way.

Lydea: Mm mm It's an opportunity, I guess, as well, like, um, to [01:36:00] maybe try and, and it might be a center camp thing to have maybe a, I think somebody floated this idea of a, a a, maybe it's a works board or a space where you might be, Hey, I've got these skills. Does anybody need them? Or, I would like to cook some Dar, does anybody have some kitchen space that I can utilise?

Yeah. And we can check that board and maybe connect, help connect people. Um, 'cause yeah, the, the dial people would've certainly been welcome at Toad Hall to use our facilities and, and serve there. And I'm sure there are plenty of other places where they could have occupied in a popup of. Other people's infrastructure.

Dylan: Mm-hmm.

Stevan: You might wanna make that war a, a part of the map, part of the legend. Not just to go renegade. 'cause people don't know about this stuff, so.

Lydea: Yeah. Yeah. Look, it's official this year. We are, we are coming back in an official capacity. But that's another thought. Maybe the, again, like the renegade might be communicated through [01:37:00] the what, where, when as well.

But I love, I do love that you find stuff that's just stealth as you said.

Dylan: Yeah. Discovery is important.

Lydea: Discovery is important. That finding things that are unexpected, it's fantastic. Part of a burn, an idea I'd put out there into universe for somebody else to pick up. 'cause I have too many pies as a concept of a first time burner camp.

Um, maybe might, people might like the idea of, hey, our theme camp is actually, we are welcoming first time burners.

Sacha: Maybe we can each take a quota.

Lydea: Yeah, I like that. A tithe of, of newbies.

Stevan: What I'd like to see is, is uh, an encouragement of micro camps where maybe just, uh, less than five people, um, you get some micro camp grants that can initiate any activity or any ideas.

Dylan: Mm. Or soms theme camp camps.

Lydea: Yeah. I like that Stevan. 'cause it is, most [01:38:00] people think theme camp. They think the big sound camps, they think 40 odd people. And then you've got, oh my God, I've gotta do kitchen, I've gotta do waste. I've gotta do so much.

Dylan: They need to do fundraisers. I need to get enough money to put this together.

I need Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Lydea: And, and camp can be yeah, toad halls. Currently four people. That's it. We're coming back with four. That's all we need. Um, but the gifting, it can be just individual people gifting, but it doesn't have to be big. It doesn't have to be cumbersome. Um, yeah. Bring those tiny little camps.

Bring them.

Stevan: Okay. Let's go on a last break. Uh, we'll be right back after these short messages and when we come back we'll just do some quick thought experiments and look at the burn calendar for this year.

Hotwire: Hey, what's up? This is Hotwire. Uh, this year at Underland, I'm the Sandman lead 'cause poor BJ hurt his back. Hopefully he comes back. Same with Ninja. We miss you guys. I just wanna say big love you so much to Stevan Nam Lay and all the bonds of people [01:39:00] and everyone at Underland. This is an amazing burn. Uh, just the culture, the art, and just the support that everyone gave to each other.

It was really good. Um, yeah, just amazing guys. Was really, really wonderful to be a part of and amazing to watch and learn from everybody. It was amazing. So thank you so much and I'll see you the next year. You.

Ty: Sure, of course. Uh, I am Tyrie Ranger Tyrie. Um, and I would encourage the community to, uh, participate. I think one of the best ways to participate, little bit participate is, um, rangering, uh, I think especially due to my neurodiversity, I think it assists me dropping into the space. It, uh, has me meeting people I wouldn't normally meet, get into spaces I wouldn't normally get into, or certainly feel comfortable getting into, um, meeting people and creating friends, which is [01:40:00] always difficult, um, in the default, um, yeah.

Uh, building community, um, through the, the work we do and, uh, increasing that social capital for the, the Rangers worldwide even. Um, yeah, um, definitely please come along and Ranger and even if you, uh, come along to the, the, uh, the training and see how you go with that. Um, and maybe you don't even participate that, that year, but maybe the next year you, uh, that you, uh, look at Rangering and volunteering that way.

It's my, my easiest gift. I, I struggle to coordinate gifts in, uh, real life, but, um, gifting my time through Rangering is, uh, my go-to.

Dana: Hello, lovely burn people. You may not even be at Burns yet, but you know that you belong here and you are welcome. I am Dana, or I'm the player. My name is Carabiner [01:41:00] and I, I am always very grateful to be at a burn because it is all about the people.

Burns don't happen if you don't bring it. So you bring what you want and you create what you want, and the community will be there to support that. And it's such a great place to come and find the people like you. Um, so hopefully we see you again soon.

Ness: Hello everyone. May anness here from Underland 2025. Um, just finished my range wing shift off the back of a perimeter shift. Absolutely, great experience. Would recommend it to [01:42:00] everyone. Think we need more people who are willing to ranger the last shift of the event. That would be fabulous. Good vibes. Lots and lots of beautiful gifts.

I think my favorite tonight has been steamy hot towels with eucalyptus and ka mile oil. Thank you and great braining team. Love your work. See you at Aurora in Tasmania, November.

Shaye: Hi burners from Underland in Victoria in Australia. We have had a wonderful time here in Paradise having our events. It has been such a wonderful time, lots of production value. Everybody here is a doer. [01:43:00] It has been really magical and we can't wait to do it all over again next year. So if you're interested, we're about building community.

We don't really do any type of advertising. It's all word of mouth, uh, because we are about our local community and making it stronger, working together collaboratively. Thanks for playing Burn Bright and uh, maybe we'll see you out here.

RaveDaddy: Hey everybody, this is Rave Daddy and Dusty Kicks. Say hi, dusty Kicks.

Snoozing: Hi.

RaveDaddy: We have had the best burn yet. I think what an Underland 2025 was. I wanna thank all the artists, all the workers, all the safety people, just everybody who contributed. We, uh, this is my favorite week of the year. This is Christmas and Halloween and Easter all rolled into one plus a birthday on top.

Thank you from the bottom of my heart. I love you Underland Rave. Daddy over and out you.

Snoozing: Bye.[01:44:00]

Stevan: Okay, welcome back. Let's, let's talk about some th let's, let's do some thought experiments. Uh, let's talk about what are you guys, um, what are some of your projections or some of your future thoughts about where we're going with the, the burn community and our culture?

Sacha: I think one of the issues that we had was, uh, several team leads pulled out close to the event.

So I think one of the future growth areas is the support around the team leads, um, that governance and succession, that's really important. Things that we've learned across the decade of burning. You're not doing it alone when you put your hand up, there's gonna be people around you. There's gonna be a history, there's hopefully gonna be documentation systems, but how can we get people to feel safe, to put themselves forward?

Because I think people get scared off, but it's fulfilling, rewarding, and supported activities.

Lydea: Yeah, I agree. And I think, um, the best we can, we can do that I think is just educate, educate, let [01:45:00] people know exactly, um, what these things involve. Like I had a absolute fantastic time on the gate with the greeters.

Um, we had music there, we had the burn barrel, we had drinks. We had a great little mini party waiting for people to come through. Um, and it's a fantastic fun time. And it, you, the ranges is the same. You walk around, you get to know people, you get free food, you get free drink everywhere you go. There's beautiful, you know, it's really fun.

It's a really fun thing to do. And, um, even toilet ninjing is get the job done and, and, and then I've got nothing to do for the rest of the day. So, so there's really advantages to all of that. So let's educate our, our people to, to get involved.

Stevan: Yeah. One of the things that was talked about in the Survival guide was photography.

So could we get [01:46:00] into a future trend where, you know, uh, social media has taken over where we don't want any photographs or any videos of, of, of our, of our event or our of of our burns. Are we getting more private?

Dylan: I think those photographs are really important. Um, it's, I had quite a few people come up to me who hadn't managed to get photographs of the effigy and say, Hey, can you send me, can you send me some pictures?

Because it was really awesome. I didn't, I just didn't take any, and, and it was really good. And I remember there was quite a lot of, you know, uh, consent issues around a lot of the photographs that, that were taken. Like, oh, do we need to get s from everybody who's in these photographs to, you know, um, be able to use these photographs?

I think that, you know, getting that kind of blanket agreement on people who are walking in to say, look, there are, there are dedicated photographers who are here that are gonna be official and they could be anyone who's contributing to that, who's got a eye and a nice camera and [01:47:00] wants to do it, and that CAV are gonna ensure that there are no compromising, you know, kind of things that come outta it.

That would be, that would be good, a good thing to do so that people can go, oh, I wanna check that out. You know, I wanna go and see those pictures and, and remember those moments.

Lydea: I, I encourage, leave the phone at home. I think it's fantastic to have photographers there who are there to, that's their gift, um, to put those photos on social media.

But people want radical expression and that doesn't happen if you are being. Watched. Yeah. And recorded. Um, yeah. It, it can impact on what people feel comfortable doing or wearing or just, just,

Dylan: or not wearing.

Lydea: Or not wearing, you know, that

Dylan: Yeah. The official photographer at the dude dance around the effigy might not be appropriate.

Lydea: Yes. Yeah. And, uh, I think it, it also, it can, and I [01:48:00] know, you know, a lot of people do require phones, but it, it, it still can be a barrier to being fully immersed in a way too. So, yeah. It's a, I think it's a discussion that needs to continue what our official voice is on is it leave the phone in, in the, the tent, you know?

Sacha: Yeah, I see. You might see someone walk into a theme camp and start recording a video and then getting everyone in the shot and it, it's not what we're about. That's not, um, taking pictures of objects is one thing, but I, the ideal scenario is that you ask people if they are okay being in your media, and that is way more restrictive than the default world.

Lydea: Yeah. But it also looking for that consent is like, I'm in the middle of something here.

Dylan: Yeah. Can you don't,

can you not ask me if I'd like my photograph?

Because you, you're breaking my stream of thought.

Lydea: Yeah. Yeah. And I don't want to remember the default world right now.

Sacha: So it's about how people interact with the space and people.[01:49:00]

Maybe getting your phone out and taking a photo or filming isn't being as immediate as you could be. And maybe there's something on the other side of that choice that you might enjoy.

Lydea: Mm, yeah,

Dylan: I know I can't answer that. Pretty big issue

Sacha: on ongoing.

Dylan: It's got strength, strength on both sides.

Lydea: I think you can, as

Dylan: you know, tho tho those, those parents who are out there with their kids, they're taking photos of their kids.

'cause these are memories for them. You know, these are things that they wanna

Lydea: Yeah.

Dylan: Record and,

Lydea: but if they're taking photos of their kids

Dylan: capture

Lydea: with, you know, being mindful of where their kids are when they take those photos. Yeah, yeah.

Dylan: Of course,

Lydea: of course. Yeah. And there's,

Dylan: there's no nude people behind them.

Lydea: Yeah. Or like, even any people, like people are, you know, vulnerable even to, um, you can be in bright colored, crazy clothing, but you're a Supreme Court judge, you know, so it's, yeah. Yeah, yeah. It's just not the, not just the radical kink, but also, yeah, as I [01:50:00] said, dropping people outta the experience they're having by feeling impacted on.

But you can definitely take photos of your kids with some art in the background or. Around the, you know, there's places where that can be done maybe.

Dylan: Mm. Maybe that's a really nice, maybe what's happening here is it's not about setting a rule to go. You can or you can't. Mm. But it's actually about through education, as you say.

Mm-hmm. Letting people know, Hey, look, you know, this is a place of really free expression. Yeah. And be really conscious about what you're taking photographs of. We're not gonna tell you that. The rule is you can't because you're here and you're intelligent.

Lydea: Yeah.

Dylan: But, you know, take photos of your loved ones.

Take photos of the art. Don't take photographs of people, um, who, who, who you don't have consent from. And if you see someone in an absolutely fabulous, wacky costume, go hello to them. Do you know what I mean? Actually introduce, they might want to consent to a photo. Yeah, exactly. They [01:51:00] might be their loving, it's having the conversation, but don't, yeah.

Don't take a photograph of them without, it's collaborative because you,

Sacha: collaborative meaning making rather than instruction.

Dylan: Yeah. The invitation is you love what they're wearing, so go and say hi, fucking love what you're wearing. You look amazing.

Lydea: Oh, you know,

Dylan: just, and start a conversation.

Lydea: Just sneak up from behind

Dylan: and, and if turns into a photograph that turns into a photograph, wonderful.

But it's done with consent. Like, you don't go and hug someone that looks great without saying, Hey, can I give you a hug?

Sacha: Well keep building that culture.

Dylan: So there's Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And I think the opportunity is to say, Hey, you know, you can take pictures of, of, of anything you wanna, but here, this is how, this is how we roll.

Lydea: Mm-hmm.

Stevan: My, my concern. Yeah.

Dylan: So it's,

Stevan: my concerns is a, is a, the, the technology that we have is gonna be ubiquitous and it's gonna be, uh, you won't notice it, it, it, it'll be unnoticeable. Uh,

Dylan: yeah, sure. But we're all humans. And like, if there's a cunt in there who's wanting to fucking video something [01:52:00] that's clearly not supposed to be videoed, that's, that's, you know, that, that's up to the community to turn around and say, what are you doing, buddy?

You can't do that. You know, that's not, it's not on,

Stevan: yeah.

Dylan: It's like I've been, I've been going to the, I've been to the Hellfire club once or twice before, and that's super consent oriented. Mm-hmm. You know, no one, no one is doing that stuff because everybody around them is aware that you can't, this isn't like.

A concert where everyone has their phone out and no one's watching the show. You know?

Lydea: Yeah.

Dylan: This is a different place.

Lydea: I've, I've had that interaction with a, watching a lady taking 3 million selfies or whatever, and she was just missing the people trying to talk to her or walk past her. Yeah. And, um, and she came up to me and said, ah, can you take a photo of me on the back to this?

And I did. I took the photo of her, but then I turned it off and tried to break into her phone so that it shut down for an hour and I gave it back to her and said, this is my gift to you.

Dylan: My gift to you is,

Lydea: [01:53:00] yeah.

Dylan: Use your eyes.

Lydea: You're locked outta your phone for an hour. Go meet some friends. I'm a very bad, nice.

I'm a very bad person.

Dylan: I like that, Lydia. That's radical.

Stevan: And, and the emerging, the emerging issues or trend of ai, how do you think that'll play out in our community?

Dylan: Okay.

Sacha: It's a big question. I think

Dylan: Fucking stop.

Lydea: Where's my, where's my jet pack? We're talking about technology. Where's my personal jet pack?

Sacha: Yeah. If it's ai, robots,

Lydea: ai, the Paris

Sacha: around the paddock I'm in.

Lydea: Yep. Done.

Dylan: AI bicycles that don't fall over

Sacha: Perfect.

Dylan: No matter how drunk you are.

Lydea: Done

Dylan: fucking fantastic

Lydea: into that giant robot elephant. That's what I want.

Dylan: Are you worried about Stevan with ai? Are you worried about, are you worried about grok undressing people?

Are you worried about people asking chat gt where the next fucking free meal is, or what, what Whatcha worried about

Stevan: the artistic expression? It is not of the human.

Dylan: Yeah, yeah. But, but, but, but you worried that people are gonna use [01:54:00] AI to make art in the Underland community and put it up and go, look at my art that's been created by a machine.

Stevan: Well, it ha it, it has been, have you seen some of the postcards that's been distributed? Uh, it, it's the, I guess the, it, it doesn't feel authentic. The, like the pictures and the layout.

Sacha: Well, you know what, it's just another medium, so use it or don't use it, and we'll respond as we will.

Lydea: And people, people who are gifting have, um, different, different skill sets, different ways that they gift and, um, they, yeah.

Might wanna do, as you said, the postcards don't have the skill or the time or the resources to hand draw. Things people will bring what they bring.

Sacha: I really enjoyed using the wax seals for my letter.

Lydea: Oh yes.

Sacha: That's very un ai.

Lydea: Yeah.

Sacha: It's just another medium. That's just another

Dylan: AI wax seals.

Lydea: That's so toad hall,

Dylan: I think.

I think Stevan, the culture that, that the burner community and the underland in particular is building, is one that is based on [01:55:00] humanity and craft, and there's no lack of technology at Underland. Look at all of the projections and lights and interactive kind of art experiences. I would, I would hate to say no.

Ai. Um, what I would like to say is AI with intent, use it as an instrument. It's not a tool, it's an instrument if you know how to play it to make some incredible experience happen where you can map light on trees, great. Brilliant. You know, wonderful. But, but I think we're a pretty smart community. We're pretty connected and, and if we saw slop, we'd go, Ooh, slop not interested.

Lydea: I think, um, we can hear the voice that is behind whatever's being gifted. Yeah. I think that's the, the, the, the intent, as you said, of the gift and, and the voice, the, is a distinct difference between something that's branded and commercial as opposed to something that comes from somebody's heart. And humans can spot that immediately.

Dylan: I sat with a friend [01:56:00] who was doing, doing some gifting thinking and was working with chat GPT to come up with, you know. Quirky little statements to print on cards. They were all shit. And I came up with like 15 brilliant ones, uh, using ni

Lydea: Yeah.

Dylan: Natural intelligence. And, and, and they were so much fucking better.

And she was just like, oh yeah, this much better. You, you're pretty good with words. I said, yes, cutting linguist, you know,

Lydea: but as I said it, it comes from the heart.

Dylan: Yeah. And I think Stevan, you can't ban it. What we have to do is educate people about why it, why and when it's crap.

Stevan: Yeah, definitely. Banning is is not the right way to go about it.

Dylan: Totally.

Stevan: But it, it is, it is gonna be a, a very topical and emerging trend. So something that we should have conversations about. Okay. Let's get into our last segment is the gratitude and shout out hour. Let's do some shout outs of, uh, who do you want to, uh, [01:57:00] give thanks to?

Lydea: Oh, so many.

Dylan: Yeah. Above and beyond the community.

Yeah, definitely Axel for helping me understand the intent process of building and, you know, delivering the gift of the effigy. Definitely roll. Uh, and my whole crew who helped me build, build the thing to, you know, all of my colleagues and people in real, in the real world, who gave me the time off to go and do that.

So the contributors who gave me so much stuff out of their waste stream, I, you know, and, and contributed to, to, to making the thing and to, yeah, just everybody's generosity. It's quite extraordinary.

Sacha: I'd love to shout out to Bek from Center Camp for holding everything together. Yeah.

Lydea: Space Cake

Sacha: and also Dan at Center Camp holding all the physical things together, lighting together and to all the Toad Hall people.

I look forward to doing as [01:58:00] little as possible in the most fun way possible with all of you.

Lydea: Oh, you silly goose. You silly, silly goose. I like to, um, show, shout out to a, a beautiful lady who, who, who camped with us last minute, who was one of the leads in sanctuary. Um, I won't use sort of names and everything, but she, um, she was there for me in a moment when I needed support and, um, I think that, I think her generosity and her willingness to talk, um, I'd like to shout out, um, to Toby Winter Mute, who got took so many great, um, site crew plans.

I know there's a lot of people who do. Um, all that stuff in spam and um, I dunno him all, but I know Toby, so I'll, I'll shout out to him 'cause I don't think there was a second when I didn't see him working.

Dylan: Ah, yeah, I, that just reminds me, I have to do a shout [01:59:00] out to Rhea on the spam crew because she provided me with a hot water bottle that was like, as long as my leg and kept me warm.

And the next request I had, which was for a chainsaw, she also had one of those and I was just like, you are the room of requirement.

Lydea: Yeah. I wanna shout out to Badger who was there with Hot Volant and champagne at like, I don't know, it was like 2:00 AM in the morning or something or other, without of whom I would not have survived.

Dylan: Yeah. Right.

Stevan: Yes, definitely shout out to all the Common Arts Victoria team and all the people that worked behind the scenes at Underland. And thanks to Sacha, to Dylan, to Lydea, and to Jenni for coming on. Thanks very much guys, for giving us some of your opinions and your experiences.

Lydea: Thanks for inviting us.

Sacha: Great to be here.

Dylan: It's, it's a,

Lydea: yeah.

Dylan: Wonderful community to be welcomed into.

Lydea: Mm-hmm.

Stevan: And hope to see you.

Lydea: Oh, we're gonna do terrible things to you, Dylan.

Dylan: Oh, I can't wait. [02:00:00] Promises. Promises.

Stevan: Yes. Uh, so hopefully we'll see each other at threshold. Um, thanks very much for coming on. This is going straight to the pool room.

Dylan: Yeah. And at the burning parks and the burning pubs in between.

Lydea: Yeah. Let's, let's do a shout out to the burning parks that the Melbourne has run. Yeah, I think that's a wonderful way to stay connected. That's how I met Dylan for the first time.

Dylan: Yeah, exactly.

Lydea: And, um, they're a great way to stay connected with the community and find out what fundraisers are going on and, and markets and, and all the things that are happening that are outside of the festival.

Stevan: Yeah. Those, those burning pubs and burning parks are good introductions for, for curious folks about our community, about our culture to get getting involved. Alright. Thank you.

Sacha: Cheers too.

Stevan: See you guys later.

Lydea: Good night.

Sacha: Don't close the browser till the audio's uploaded.

Stevan: Yes.

Lydea: Thanks, dad. All right.

Stevan: Good night.

See you later. Bye.[02:01:00]

Snoozing: Yo, what's up? It's snoozing from Perth. Um, had a great, great weekend with four of my best friends here at Underland. And, uh, let me tell you, it's the first time it's felt like coming home since, um, my, my life changing burns at Blazing Swan. Um, I love you guys. Take care.

Mink: Hello. Hello, hello, this is Mink also from Perth. Um, just wanna send a big squeeze to everyone in the community. Just had a beautiful weekend at Underland and yeah, it's been really good coming home. Um, yeah, love to you all.

Jules: Hello everyone. This is Jules, also from Perth. Um, just wanna say a huge thank you to everyone for putting this on.

We really, really appreciated the party and the vibes. Um, and yeah, it was lovely to come home. Thank you very much. See you next time.[02:02:00]

Stefan: Hello everyone. This is Stefan. Also some from Perth. I just wanted to say thank you to everyone who put this on and made this such an amazing time. We danced, we laughed, we cried, we played with silly toys, we met amazing people and I'm so grateful for this experience and I love you all and I can't wait to be back next year.

Buddy: Hello, this is Buddy again from Melbourne. Um, this was an amazing, amazing experience with everyone. It was really special to share something that my friends felt was really special and they shared it with me, so I'm very happy. Thank you. It'll be around, it'll be around. We, we have some highlights from, from the weekend.

I'll kick it off. Um, uh, I love horses in jackets. I also have a really beautiful quote from the weekend that I read in the temple, which [02:03:00] is, being present is better than being everywhere. And that really resonated with, um, everyone in our group that we came with. Um, I wanna just know for this photo, if we are smiling or if we're just fucking around, I just have some sage advice for everyone.

Uh, the squeaky will gets the grease. Remember that for next time. And just to circle back to the horses and jacket ones, it must be said like, I love horses and jackets.

Thank you. That's so funny.

Perfect.

Oh, thank you so much. Thank you so much.

RainbowRob: Yeah, man. Um, Burn's been very amazing. Had some life stuff going on that I wasn't sure if I'd make it, but, um, it's always good to get out here amongst friends and, [02:04:00] um, feel that belonging to community. No collective love and creativity that we all bring. Um, yeah, I feel, um, burn events and other festivals, uh, some of the places that feel most like home, most, like we can take off our masks and be who we really are and be inspired by others to be more ourselves.

Yeah. Just, um, yeah, had a lot of really warming and heartfelt experiences with people and yeah, it's funny coming back to these places and feeling more like [02:05:00] disconnected in myself outside of these places and coming back and being like, oh, that's right. I belong. Things are cool. Can just drop more into myself.

Usually it takes a couple days to drop into these places you really like sink in and just feel more comfortable, more, more whole. And yeah, I think, um, going to Rainbow Serpent Festival a long time ago really inspired me in that direction. Like, wow, here's people that are just being authentic and nonjudgmental and the whole world could be like this.

Wow. You know? So, Hmm. Yeah. Deep gratitude for these spaces. Underland is really up there. Maybe one, one of my favorite festivals. Um, yeah. Beautiful community. Nice to have a burn. [02:06:00] So close to Melbourne. Yeah. Excited by a Tassie burn. Got some swag from a guy for the 2025 one just recently, like last night, so might have to go to that.

Sounds cool. There's a plug. Aurora, Aurora Burn, I guess. Yeah. Always a very pleasant time with you, my brother. Uh, deep Chats and Rainbow Rob. So yeah. Always appreciate our deep chats about philosophical and spiritual things and hearing all the good projects you're up to and receiving your beautiful stickers.

Much love my bro.

Rochelle: Thank you. That's a good answer. I was like, uh, I dunno, an opinion. Fuck your from me. Definitely. [02:07:00] Michelle Dunton, Collingwood Victoria represent you from Collingwood too?

Nah,

nah. And I have a gorgeous little dog named Crumpet. Do you wanna see a, A

picture?

Yeah. Do you wanna hear about my dog?

Oh yeah, sure. Go.

It's my dog Crumpet. She's a two kilo teacup poodle.

Oh my God. And she's the cutest dog you've ever seen. Cute as hell. And I will show you a photo of her at the pub this week. This is her at the pub this week. Like as she has hair. Your hair on the side.

Coffee with my guy. This is amazing. Mm.

She's fucking perfect. Look at her. And wait, is she inside? Yeah.

The pub. Nice. She loves going to the pub. Her favorite food is steak. Big fan of Steak Night on Thursday nights in Collingwood. You would find that at the Grace Darling. If you wanted a steak on a Thursday, on a Wednesday night, the Fitzroy Town Hall, [02:08:00] Tuesday night we would go to the Rachi and Monday night we would go to Marquee of Lawn.

Oh. Oh, that's a good app. Or builder's arms, which I think is the best steak night in Melbourne. Builder's arms is good. That's actually my secret skill. This is maybe what my podcast is gonna be about, is that if you name. Any day of the week, I can tell you what. Steak com par night. It is at which pub? In the inner north, uh, Wednesday I'd go to the rachi.

Oh. Oh really? Okay. This is good. Wednesday's like not a great steak night. Oh, it's a good par. It's great par night. So Birmingham lovely. Yeah, they used to be so cheap. Five or $6. Just go there in my uni days. Yep. Stunning. I love this. I could really get around this. I love any like UCUC. This is not, why is USC me?

I'm not sure. What's your arrange? Just dust ranger? Uh, right here. Oh, that's alright. Yeah. Good mate. [02:09:00] Just be advised, I'm gonna take the Ute back to Benji's camp to pick up a couple of boxes and then take it straight back to the ranges. So I'll be gone for like five minutes, but I'll respond to it while Yes.

Yes. Yeah. Yes. How did you know? I was like, literally did I?

Transcripts transcribed by Descript AI